World of Banished

MODS Garage => Mod Discussions 107 => Topic started by: Discrepancy on December 11, 2017, 04:08:26 AM

Title: DS Timber Mill v2.1 (updated 13 June 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on December 11, 2017, 04:08:26 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/gaZhrkg.jpg)
it was called DS Lumber Mill, but after a name change, a UI face-lift and a few other goodies added,
it is now known as:

DSTimber Mill

all buildings (timber mill, foresters & storage places) have a reworked UI,
and now have an included info tab to give you some building & resource information in-game:

v2.1  limits are now in a tab:
(https://i.imgur.com/4zMV4eQ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/camV6ih.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/R8IPjO1.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/t11r75Y.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/W1mtmKW.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/kuxd6xs.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/ezjEBt1.jpg)
all deco pieces now have a demolish/remove button in UI:
(https://i.imgur.com/9nksNs6.jpg)



Latest version:  2.0  -  13 June 2018


Download: DS Timber Mill v2.1 (http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?action=downloads;sa=view;down=381) from here.
**remember, the mod file name is still called DSLumberMill.pkm  ;)


Change Log:

v2.1    -  update **lumber mill and vanilla woodcutter must be demolished & rebuilt!  --  13 June 2018  |  .zip = 8.98mb (9,198kb)   .pkm = 13.3mb (13,621kb)
        -  changed RawMaterialLumber.rsc storage flag back to custom5 limit (building materials)
        -  changed storage of 1x1 lumber pile to match resource change.
        -  updated UI texts.
        -  updated resource files
        -  changed firewood production quantity to 6-8, Timber 2-3
        -  changes to vanilla woodcutter production.


v2.0    -  Major update **Not save compatible!!  --  16 May 2018  |  .zip = 8.98mb (9,198kb)   .pkm = 13.3mb (13,621kb)
        -  change of mod name to Timber Mill, .pkm file remains DSLumberMill.pkm
        -  change of resource string name for RawMaterialLumber.rsc to Timber
        -  change of building names & texts from lumber to timber
        -  changed deco versions of log piles to ghosted pieces
        -  changed RawMaterialLumber.rsc storage flag to wood limit
        -  changes to toolbar icons & texts
        -  changed wharf pieces - textures split into separate toolbar buttons
        -  changes to all file structures, names, removal of unneeded code
        -  changes to timber mill: work points, building speeds, construction & production
        -  added Pine & Birch forester buildings
        -  added storage versions of log piles

v1.1    -  Update  --  12 April 2018  |  .zip = 7.64mb (7,826kb)   .pkm = 11.2mb (11,548kb)
        -  added 2nd texture variant for lumber mill and wharf pieces.
        -  updated lumber template file and production cost.
        -  updated new lumber mesh files.
        -  texture file and material changes.
        -  DS toolbar file update.

v1.0    -  Initial release  --  11 December 2017  |  .zip = 7.64mb (6,307kb)   .pkm = 8.95mb (9,166kb)





Code: [Select]
Translation modding:want to translate this mod?
you can download the stringtables for this mod from here
: DSTimberMill_v2.1_stringtables.zip (https://mega.nz/#!SRcl1QhA!FQ2SI5JJKW79ZhwR-k_fuR_beo4Err-wkcdbsXuC-rE)
**upon request, help can be given regarding some of the texts and if needing code change to fit within UI


Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill
Post by: pappa on December 11, 2017, 05:29:28 AM
Thank you
welcome back
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill
Post by: Maldrick on December 11, 2017, 07:37:08 AM
Looks nice, @Discrepancy !

Thank you and welcome back, as well.
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill
Post by: galensgranny on December 11, 2017, 08:48:31 AM
Very nice!  Thanks for making something else for the game!  :)
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill
Post by: adelegarland on December 11, 2017, 09:47:01 AM
As Always, Perfect!    I'm so glad you are back, Can I ask a favor?  Your Celtic House, the round one, can you make a smaller version?  Please????   Thanks DS. 
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill
Post by: Gatherer on December 11, 2017, 02:42:36 PM
HO! HO! HO! Christmas came early!

Loving it 8)
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill
Post by: Discrepancy on December 11, 2017, 11:26:00 PM
Thanks :)


Feedback. Always welcome.

(my own...)
I'm using the CC values for the lumber, but i think maybe they are not of value to build with.
And consequently i have made the wharf sections too expensive.?

Stone Bridge will be out soon... before Christmas. It will require Lumber, and Stone.

Can I ask a favor?  Your Celtic House, the round one, can you make a smaller version?  Please????
yes, in the works.
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill
Post by: Maldrick on December 12, 2017, 03:07:25 AM
I'm using the CC values for the lumber, but i think maybe they are not of value to build with.
And consequently i have made the wharf sections too expensive.?

Haven't played with CC extensively, but I just tested a bunch of lumber producers for a big set I put together.  Balance is all over the place, really. Was just going to see how it worked in-game.  I'll load yours and check it out too, when I do.  I'm giving it a few days to let the freshness of testing wear off before I sink in.

Stone Bridge will be out soon... before Christmas. It will require Lumber, and Stone.

Christmas in time for Christmas.  Happy dance! :P. Been in love with that bridge since it was in the dock set beta and was credibly concerned we might never see it.  Looking forward to it!
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill
Post by: Tom Sawyer on December 12, 2017, 10:17:57 AM
Tried it on a Nordic map. Looks great and also works at the first glance, even with CC flagging code inside. A pity I don't have a use of lumber.^^ What about a floor definition to let them walk in/on the mill? :)

I did not think about balancing of lumber mills yet but I find the CC values reasonable. Probably it means a lost of material by sawing from 6 to 5 and wasting by uneducated workers of 20%. Maybe I would remove this lost of wood. The work time setting is exactly the same like I use for my watermill (4/2).
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill
Post by: ancientmuse on December 12, 2017, 04:36:55 PM
I was wondering about the logs to lumber ratios.

In the real world you usually get anywhere from 2 to 4 planks of lumber from one log when you cut it lengthwise.  Lumber planks are 1-2 inches thick, so depending on thickness of the log, you get a few planks from it. 

So the ratios where it takes more logs to make less lumber in Banished (and CC) always had me kind of scratching my head... shouldn't it be the other way around ?

Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill
Post by: Tom Sawyer on December 12, 2017, 05:24:04 PM
Yes, for the feeling it sounds better to make more lumber from a log. But actually it depends on the usage of lumber as building material. If a house needs 30 logs to be built and another house with the same dimensions made from lumber needs 30 as well then it is wood in different forms but in the same amount and processed in the ratio 1:1. Imagined as a pile of boards and planks made from one log and with the same weight (storage capacity). That's probably the simplest solution in game. If lumber is made from logs in a higher ratio then it should also be used in a higher ratio as material to be logical. If 1:2 then this house should need about 60 lumber but this way it is not used in mods as far as I know. :)
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on April 12, 2018, 07:52:35 AM
Updated to: v1.1
        -  added 2nd texture variant for lumber mill and wharf pieces.
        -  updated lumber template file and production cost.
        -  updated new lumber mesh files.
        -  texture file and material changes.
        -  DS toolbar file update.

(https://i.imgur.com/KOWiI1d.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/N3cUAUX.jpg) (https://i.imgur.com/DYpBvSE.jpg)
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: elemental on April 13, 2018, 03:53:35 AM
The link is taking me to a download for v1.0, not v1.1.
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: Hawk on April 13, 2018, 05:39:49 AM
I just checked and can verify what @elemental said.
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: TheOtherMicheal on April 13, 2018, 06:29:01 AM
Yes, I checked it also and as @elemental and @Hawk have said, the link is still version 1.0 (I checked in game to see if I could get the second texture and no luck).
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on April 13, 2018, 06:32:56 AM
Sorry about that. I had forgotten to delete the last Url link in the download. Try again it should work :)
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: TheOtherMicheal on April 13, 2018, 06:38:03 AM
Thanks and thanks for the super fast response (it must be getting on to midnight on your side of Australia at the moment?)


EDIT: Just checked the new download in game and I verify that it is V1.1 (I can see both textures).
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: elemental on April 13, 2018, 03:17:40 PM
Glad to know I wasn't going crazy.  :)

Is it save game compatible? Do I have to delete anything first?
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: TheOtherMicheal on April 13, 2018, 07:13:44 PM
I added it straight to my saved game however I had not built the DS Lumber Mill in my game.
I think it will be like any other update that adds new textures - delete the old lumber mill, save the game, add the new lumber mill mod then build it again in the saved game.
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: calli74 on May 14, 2018, 10:34:52 AM
I found an issue with the decorative pieces in my game, the one tile filler squares have no way to be removed. There is no dustbin icon on them and the structure removal tool won't pick them up either. I'm not sure if it was just another mod conflicting, going to test that now.

Oh, just realised I'm using the version in Megamod 8 and not the download from here, maybe that has something to do with it.
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: calli74 on May 14, 2018, 11:37:50 AM
I just tested in a vanilla game with only this mod installed and can confirm that I still can't remove the 1x1 filler tile.
Title: Re: DS Lumber Mill v1.1 (updated 12 April 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on May 14, 2018, 11:53:27 PM
thank you @calli74 ,

you are correct, I'd forgotten to add the remove button to the UI.

I am working on an update to the mod, but unfortunately it is not going to be save-game compatible.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on May 16, 2018, 03:43:24 AM
updated to: v2.0

it was called DS Lumber Mill, but after a name change, a UI face-lift and a few other goodies added,
it is now known as:

DSTimber Mill

(https://i.imgur.com/qbSEgwT.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/NloLc6D.jpg)
all buildings (timber mill, foresters & storage places) have a reworked UI,
and now have an included info tab to give you some building & resource information in-game:

(https://i.imgur.com/ZIPIGvI.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/R8IPjO1.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/t11r75Y.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/W1mtmKW.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/kuxd6xs.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/ezjEBt1.jpg)
all deco pieces now have a demolish/remove button in UI:
(https://i.imgur.com/9nksNs6.jpg)



Download: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?action=downloads;sa=view;down=381) from here.
**remember, the mod file name is still called DSLumberMill.pkm  ;)


Change Log:

v2.0    -  Major update **Not save compatible!!  --  16 May 2018  |  .zip = 8.98mb (9,198kb)   .pkm = 13.3mb (13,621kb)
        -  change of mod name to Timber Mill, .pkm file remains DSLumberMill.pkm
        -  change of resource string name for RawMaterialLumber.rsc to Timber
        -  change of building names & texts from lumber to timber
        -  changed deco versions of log piles to ghosted pieces
        -  changed RawMaterialLumber.rsc storage flag to wood limit
        -  changes to toolbar icons & texts
        -  changed wharf pieces - textures split into separate toolbar buttons
        -  changes to all file structures, names, removal of unneeded code
        -  changes to timber mill: work points, building speeds, construction & production
        -  added Pine & Birch forester buildings
        -  added storage versions of log piles
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Voeille on May 16, 2018, 09:29:05 AM
I like the idea with foresters. I normally dont pair mine up with gatherers, so them maturing faster and giving less food will work well with my settlements. Thanks!
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: calli74 on May 16, 2018, 10:00:33 AM
I'm looking forward to trying this out, but right now I'm 42 years into a game I don't want to start over. Will just have to be patient, but it looks so amazing.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: taniu on May 16, 2018, 01:02:13 PM
@Discrepancy :D :D :D Thank you very much
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: tuggistar on May 16, 2018, 02:55:33 PM
Thanks for the nice and wonderful update. :) One question is how about now the lumber from the Colonial Charter, the Maritimes Collection and kid1293 as now the sequence in the list of mods.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Gatherer on May 16, 2018, 02:57:49 PM
I'm looking forward to trying this out, but right now I'm 42 years into a game I don't want to start over. Will just have to be patient, but it looks so amazing.


Same here.


I wonder if these foresters work with Necora's Pine Set?
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on May 16, 2018, 06:43:35 PM
The pine tree forester only grows vanilla modeled pine trees, there is no change in the resource drop - still 2-3 logs, only the maturity is quicker than vanilla by 4 months, and less spawned wild plants: herbs, mushrooms & berries.



This mod should work fine with other mods that add Lumber, it is still the same RawMaterial but named differently - put this mod at the top and it will be called timber, or below another that adds lumber and it will be called lumber.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: okkisafire on May 22, 2018, 10:05:31 PM
I couldn't find out how to delete 1x1 Timber Mill Wharf. Any idea?
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on May 23, 2018, 12:44:25 AM
@okkisafire , In the old version you cannot delete it unfortunately, but in the new version you can.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: okkisafire on May 23, 2018, 12:52:30 AM
@Discrepancy ow. I guess I should end the history of my near-900 population village, and find a new settlement, lol. Thank you for the answer
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Hawk on May 24, 2018, 05:08:44 AM
I just noticed a confusing (at least to me) situation with the new Timber Mill.
As shown in the screenshot below (I kind of color coded what I'm talking about  :D ), the lumber shows in the status screen as construction items but the resource limits are under logs.
If I remember right, wasn't lumber listed as a construction item before, or was that one that @RedKetchup did?

I like the animation you did with the water spray. Shame you can't animate the wheel.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Voeille on May 24, 2018, 06:13:44 AM
Id like if it used the construction limit too :) In my recent save I wanted to use up some of the logs I had, and I had to temporarily raise the log limit so the mill would work.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Gatherer on May 24, 2018, 08:11:59 AM
Id like if it used the construction limit too


+1
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on May 24, 2018, 03:43:37 PM
@Hawk , if you have another mod above in list that adds lumber it will change the timber to be stored and marked as custom5/construction, but the mill will still operate with the wood limit.

:)



what if construction doesn't exist?....
what should be in construction? Bricks, Roof tiles & Timber? should iron fittings go in there too? and wagon parts, and glass, and Lime... all used as construction.
Perhaps another name for it apart from construction materials?
And work out what I'm going to do with all the other empty limits....
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Hawk on May 24, 2018, 05:00:35 PM
@Hawk , if you have another mod above in list that adds lumber it will change the timber to be stored and marked as custom5/construction, but the mill will still operate with the wood limit.

 :)

I don't think I have another lumber/timber mod installed at all, much less above yours.
Here's my mod list, in the installed order.

Quote
banishedUImod
banishedUItownnames
banishedUImaps
banishedUIprofessions
banishedUImt
DSTerrainsAndClimates
NewLimitVanillaTP
RKMinimize
NoFog
ImprovedFarming
ImprovedGatherer
ImprovedHerbalist
ImprovedWoodcutter
orchardism
stopcoalburn
MilkFromCows
DSOilMill
ImprovedMine
DSJettyAndBridgePatchToV211
DSJettyAndBridge
NMT30ClayChain
DSLumberMill
DSStoneBridge
DSBlastFurnacePatch
DSBlastFurnace
DSBridgeCrossing
DSMarketHarboroughOldSchool
DSSmallVillageProduction
DSSmallVillageServices
DSSmallVillageStorage
DSSmallVillageHomes
DSTunnelMine
DSBrycesButcher
DSTunnels
DSStoneHovels
DSChapelofErnest
DSCrestBlacksmith
DSRoads
RKGardenWallsUtility
KidAnimalShedSA
KidForestOutpost
KidHouseBoat
KidMarketPuzzle
KidMoreHousesDark
KidPlimothHarmonized
KidRowBusiness
KidRowHousing
KidStoneHouseAddon
KidTinySeparate
KidToolEmporium
KidTwilightHerbs
KidWorkPlace
MaritimesHumbleConstruction
NMTForestCenter
RKOldBakeryHouse
RKOldBlacksmith
RKOldHunterHut
OldTailorHouse
RKstockpiles
TinySmallBarns
warehouse
MDWoodCottage
WoodButcher

what if construction doesn't exist?....
what should be in construction? Bricks, Roof tiles & Timber?

Yes.

should iron fittings go in there too? and wagon parts, and glass, and Lime... all used as construction.

Shouldn't those go under Misc?
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: brads3 on May 24, 2018, 05:55:13 PM
iron fittings and wagon parts could go under forged,custom 1.lime under materials,custome 4 since it will be moved and processed more. bricks,glass,lumbertiles under construction,custom 5. this is per RED's original list we got.
http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=1519.0

     so far i have not seen issues with different mods.they do seem to be able to use items back and forth, even if the 2 mods assign different limits to the same item.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Nilla on May 25, 2018, 12:32:12 AM
Agree with Brad about the flagging.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on May 25, 2018, 06:39:12 PM
The thing is. Forged is a funny thing... what is it? I would only have iron fittings in it as the wagon parts aren't really forged goods. whereas we squash bricks, rooftiles, timber and glass all into 1 category? seems out of balance. Remember I'm not CC, so I'm not going to have all the other resources that they add, which to a player that plays without it, makes it more confusing as to what the categories are for.
Forged could really contain: Iron, Iron Fittings & Tools... this isn't going to happen. Forged is probably my least liked limit as it doesn't have much use as being used as an actual limit.
I really think the lumber & glass need to be split from the bricks & roof tiles.

With the limits we seem to have used a lot of them for things which aren't really used in building a town, which I think they need to be. I think we probably need individual limits for important, regularly used construction items (logs, stone, iron, timber, glass, bricks, roof tiles, etc), how this can be achieved and work with other mods, I have no idea... I'm just not sure I should continue down a path that will have my mods contain resources that only use 70-80% of the limits.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Hawk on May 25, 2018, 07:03:40 PM
I didn't mean to aggravate you. I just thought lumber should go in the construction category instead of logs. That's all.

Sorry! I'll drop it and move on.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on May 25, 2018, 08:05:17 PM
no no, not aggravated. Just confused as to what to do. :)

It is just that when only my mods are played, all of the resources are only in a few of the limits, so there are a lot that just don't get used and sit there useless. This makes the point of having the extra limits in the first place a bit pointless.

An issue I have with the limits that were made is that they don't include the last 2 (apart from the North uses them). We all know that it would be better to have limits for each resource ideally, but if we don't even use these extra 2 that Luke gave us, I can't see that he will come back to give us more.

I have a few questions for players:
what are the limits that you use to actually limit production?, and why? lack of storage place for it? too low a trade value to continue producing for trade?
For those that limit wood production, why? It is producing too much, and not being used enough? I know if players are playing with real time aging this can happen, as the mod doesn't increase the age/maturity of the trees, so more wood is being produced per citizen lifetime, this to myself is a big turn-off to real-time aging mods.

I will try to come up with a list of my resources to what category. I can handle putting the Timber back into Custom5 (construction), but I'm not so sure about Glass still being in there. Also having Forged & Fabrics as a limit I'm not sure I want... @brads3 , what resources are in Forged?
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: brads3 on May 25, 2018, 08:11:14 PM
i agree the name doesn't fit well.i actually think of forged as crafted materials. those that are to be processed more or used in construction. whereas crafted,custom 0, is end goods to be traded,like furniture or beds.

     no i wasn't pushing CC.my only idea is uniformity amonst modders.as i said so far things do work. i did use a CC shoreman to get clay to build a nordic trade dock. i also wish CC had took more input before setting the limits. some are under used like fabrics.they could have gone to crafted and opened custom 2.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: brads3 on May 25, 2018, 08:24:38 PM
http://worldofbanished.com/gallery/37_20_02_17_12_01_26.png

forged: items made from metal.cannons,metal joists.
      but using it as crafted materials,it could incluse many of your items.

            i use limits in the bginning to kee stocks ahead but allow the workers to be laborers as well. in early game,you need the help. so the woodcutter,tailor,blacksmith sepnd most of their time as laborers.as the town grows i increase it and if needed add more workplaces. i do same thing with lumber to not overuse the logs. depending on the sawmill i can switch it back to firewood. the limits give a way to see if you are producing items faster than they are being processed. for instance pine materials are used to make turpentine.if i was producing more materials than the still could use i could see that and adjust workers. limits can be used if a modded building is over productive also.
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Nilla on May 26, 2018, 01:50:55 AM
We've discussed these limits/flags on many places. The problem is, that those that are generally used, were set fast, as the possibility came to use more flags. They are very much based on CC. I know, there was some discussion, but most of us not modding players, didn't participate. I didn't, because I couldn't really see, how it would work. With the experience I have now, I could say much, but I didn't felt that way, to that time.

Now we are in this situation. Most modders just use these limits, no matter how they really work with their mods. I guess primary to avoid game conflicts and confusion. And that's a good reason, no wrong in that. Others use their own. @Tom Sawyer uses his own. Maybe I'm the one here, that have played the North the most and I can really say; they do work better, than the "common flags"; in a Nordic game but they would also work better in a game with the mods from most of you main modders, active on this page.

So what is a modder like @Discrepancy supposed to do? I'm sure you want your mods to work in the North but also together with many other mods. You want your limits to make sense and be possible to use the way @brads3 describes. I don't really know how to solve this, but if we start to define a few important basic limits, that we all use in this active way. I would say; logs, fuel, clothes, tools, stone, iron, ore and keep them as "pure" as possible. Don't mix lumber or timber or anything else with the basic logs, don't mix copper, steel, iron bloom or anything else with the basic iron......... even if they from a "common sense" way of seeing, might belong there. But in a gameplay way, they don't. It would only destroy a possibility to use your worker efficient in a convenient way.

So what to do with timber, lumber, iron fittings, wagon parts, lime, coke, fertilizer, thatch, turpentine, paint, concrete, nails............... ?? They have to be put somewhere and because of the limited number of possible flags, need to be put together in a way, that's not too confusing. First we must be aware of, that as soon as we put two different products together under one flag, the possibility to use the limit to regulate to production automatically, is gone. So put a third, fourth or fifth product to a limit, doesn't really hurt, but it does hurt to put a second product to these "basics" I talked about before.

I find that the modder should think of, how these things are used, how does he want them to be stored, together with which other materials. Should it be on stockpiles or in barns? Which specialized markets and stores should hold these products?

Back to timber. This is how I would think;
1. It's wood but I don't want to destroy the log limit by putting it there.
2. I want it on stockpiles.
3. I use it mainly as building material, that could be put in a specialized store for building material.
4. Construction, custom 5 (also bricks, rooftiles...)

Iron fittings.
1. It's iron but I don't want to destroy the iron limit by putting it there.
2. I want it in barns.
3. I use it as building materials, that could be put in a specialized store for building material.
4. ?? (also glass, wagon parts, fishing gear, traps...)
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Freedom on May 26, 2018, 03:18:26 PM
Quote
I have a few questions for players:
what are the limits that you use to actually limit production?, and why? lack of storage place for it? too low a trade value to continue producing for trade?

     I gave up a long time ago on the notion of "correctly" defining what limit any particular resource belongs too. In the end, it doesn't much matter to me. I would like to see the critical basics (food, logs, tools, clothing, iron, and to an extent fuel for home use) kept "pure" but that is simply to easily see (in the General Stats window) on-hand availability rather than any concern about limit settings.

     I don't have much use for limits as a game play mechanism and mostly don't care which resource is tied to which limit. If I see a resource limit icon over a lumber mill, I either switch from lumber to firewood or reduce the numbers of workers or halt production manually, or move excess stock to a trader (even if just as temporary storage) or build more storage --or just bump the limit. To me, letting things "hit the limit" just masks production problems and takes away the fun of managing and growing the town. I keep the General Stats window open to keep an eye on things and regularly check inventory levels. That's my play style.

     If you play with any number of mods, you know that things aren't always as advertised. For instance a charcoal maker info window can show a "fuel" limit but other mods cause charcoal to be placed against the "industrial fuel" limit. The glass works wants charcoal and not furnace (industrial) fuel no matter that both count against the same limit. I care about how much charcoal is available where I need it and don't care which limit it counts against. I can always raise the limit or adjust production...

     ...which leads directly to the Storage problems. The game wants to disperse resources over all storage spots. And while I don't need Bannies placing roof tiles in a remote storage yard I'm using only to clear space for an orchard on the outskirts of town that is the reality. To the extent possible, I build restricted storage areas (stockpiles, barns, warehouses, traders, etc) that accept specific goods I produce and/or consume. Red's FireLogs stockpiles being a great example. As long as I know which limit a resource is linked to, that is enough.

Because I actively try not to have things "hitting the limits" as I consider it a failure if that happens, whether your mods encompass 20% or 80% of the available limits isn't an issue.


Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Hawk on May 26, 2018, 03:47:15 PM
I thought I had posted in this topic just before @Freedom, but I guess I deleted that post, or just not remembering right.  ;D

Anyway, I agree with what Freedom says, and that saved me a whole lot of typing, which is good because I'm a two-finger pecker. LOL!
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.0 (updated 16 May 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on May 27, 2018, 02:20:05 AM
 :)
Thank you all very much for the detailed answers.

I will make another update soon to the timber mill reverting Timber/Lumber back to Custom5 (construction).

I agree with the players, and believe it is important for you guys to have a say.

...
But there is a little more than that, I have written a post here: http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=1755.msg49556#msg49556 (http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=1755.msg49556#msg49556)
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.1 (updated 13 June 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on June 13, 2018, 07:10:45 AM
updated to v2.1

        -  changed RawMaterialLumber.rsc (Timber) storage flag back to custom5 limit (building materials)
        -  changed storage of 1x1 timber pile to match resource change.
        -  updated UI texts.
        -  updated resource files
        -  changed firewood production quantity to 6-8, Timber 2-3
        -  changes to vanilla woodcutter production.


v2.1  limits are now in a tab:
(https://i.imgur.com/4zMV4eQ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/camV6ih.jpg)
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.1 (updated 13 June 2018)
Post by: kid1293 on June 13, 2018, 07:15:23 AM
Limits in a tab?  ???

You're a wizard with menus! :)
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.1 (updated 13 June 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on June 13, 2018, 07:20:01 AM
when looking at the code it is a confusing piece of work, but simple once you can see how it works ;)

Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.1 (updated 13 June 2018)
Post by: kid1293 on June 13, 2018, 07:31:37 AM
Hmm. It is very logical but, as you say, when looking at it it is hard
to follow the logic :)
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.1 (updated 13 June 2018)
Post by: kid1293 on June 13, 2018, 07:38:04 AM
Is 'groupLimit' pre-defined?
Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.1 (updated 13 June 2018)
Post by: Discrepancy on June 14, 2018, 01:54:01 AM
we can define the groups. it is like a UI 'placer' box that we can put wherever we like within another.

if you look right down the bottom of the template file is where it is defining the groupLimit01 etc - this can be named whatever we like.

... I'll step back a bit:

to make a tab, the code is straight-forward, with a building with the inventory attached it is easy to just add on to that.

TabDescription
   Tab _tabs - calls up the tab buttons and then the content.
button is easy. just ButtonDescription code, linked to the StandardDialog.rsc:buttonTab which makes it act as a button, this links to LabelDescription code, which is simply what its title says - link the icon and text for tab button.
the content, calls up a container , ContainerDescription
this creates the size and shape of the tab screen, the scrollbar goes here.
this links to the LayoutDescription code, the reason why this code is used, is that it can call up and create the defined group locations. This is needed for limits as they must be called up via the UIDescription - ElementController _controllers, and can not be added directly to UI code (the limit spinner will not work correctly).
At the bottom I have simply created 2 groups for the 2 limits displayed, but you can make it multiple, and as many you want (i have done all the limits this way in unreleased styth tower 3 mod). The group simply acts as the placer for the code that the resource limit will call in the UI controller: String _insertAt = "group____";

adding text to a tab, like I did with the info is a little different again. there is multiple approaches though depending on the need.

simply using containerDescription code again as tab content, then linking a labelDescription code element, this can call up a stringtable text, bool _wordWrap = true; can be used with: int _wordWrapSize = ##; to limit width of text line. call up font/size/colour/image etc...

if you want to create paragraphs, move things into boxes, alternate font size, colours ets etc  etc, you will need to isolate individual pieces...
and that is by using RibbonDescription code, which allows you to list and call up individual UI elements (these can be any UI code you want to use), either vertically arranged, or horizontally: bool _vertical = true/false;
the other option is to once again use the LayoutDescription code option, it gives you more control over layout as things can layer and overlap.

But a word of warning, it can get very confusing quickly. the more you add the harder it is to keep track of. I suggest actually drawing on a piece of paper a layout you want before attempting it.
It is slow going. I have spent countless hours... it is a time trap.

I have utilised this and learnt what I know by making my update to Styth Tower... and it took it's toll on me (that's why it isn't released yet)  :D


i have attached the UI file that is the watch tower rating tab I have created. it uses a mix of elements to create this:
(https://i.imgur.com/ATHVEGT.jpg)

;) ignore the rest of the box and tabs - i didn't include them, yet.

but it is a big file to display the contents of the tab you can see (though it scrolls down a bit).
if you follow my code you can see where I got confused while making it! many secondary additions and alterations... because I didn't pre-plan very well as I didn't really know what I was doing.




Title: Re: DS Timber Mill v2.1 (updated 13 June 2018)
Post by: Nilla on June 14, 2018, 02:24:27 AM
Very interesting to get more information in the menus. :)