World of Banished

Again I've  made my 2-3 weeks Banished brake.

Than, I saw @Trizeropz´s pictures and I remembered how much I like @RedKetchup´s NMT-mod. One thing I liked with my last game, as I made all achievements on one map, was the rebuilding of the town. The same basic but a new focus. I've never done much of that in my other towns. Another thing that I've always liked with Banished is to try the limits.

So this will be my next game, these "likes" together.

Try the limits of the NMT mod with different conditions. To prevent it from being too long, too "buggy" or too slow, I will use a small map. My idea is this:

1. No farming, no trading for food/with food. I don't want any quarries, so I will trade, but only a few trading ports and not buy any food and also not sell any food, not even the annoying mushrooms. My goal is to make a settlement of 1000 people this way. We'll see what's possible.

2. When I feel it's enough, I will transform it from a forest society to a farming settlement and see how far I can push it. Still no trade with food. Maybe there are 500 more people in it.

3. Finally rebuild it again to a full trading economy. Is 4000 people possible on a small map? Maybe.

Again I took the first map I randomly looked at. I can confess that I looked at a few more, but went back to the first. It doesn't have as much free space as the best small maps but the river runs very nice and there are room for a lot of trading ports. (I'll post a picture of the settings the next time, forgot it)

First picture

This is so not like me: Planning before building. Must be sick!

The plan is simple; fill the map with "forest nodes" and the space in between with houses and other necessities.

I thought a little bit about playing with uneducated. It would have been a bit harder and maybe a bit funnier, but in this case, it would make no real difference. The limit will come faster, with less people. And I don't want that. So, first building; the school.

Second picture

This is how it looks, according the plan. Sorry, @RedKetchup, again I dig the fishing holes.  :-[ I will not use the flatten-tool, maybe for a single square, but not tear whole hills down, so I will use the mountains for fishing ponds.  :-\ :-[

I like your planning! I can see why you picked that map, the river is nearly perfect.

I look forward to watching this town. Good to see you building again.

There's not much to tell. This is an easy game (so far). I go on according to my initial plans.

First picture

Setting and mods

Second picture, year 10

I made a small mistake; I built my two first hunters without looking where the deer are. The first one is really miserable; every year only one deer, not even as I assigned 2 hunters it's more!  :( :-\ The second one was a bit better, but not perfect. The third one was built after I studied the deer and it's good.

I have ordered sheep. I will not build a large number of pastures, but so many as I need for wool to match the leather production to make warm coats.

Third picture, year 20

This is something i don't like and don't really understand. I have a lot more families than homes (51/43) but into my last 3 houses an adult male has moved in with a student female. I have checked; there are adult females still living at their parents but they seem to be very unwilling to leave home.

The map is almost full. The game is far from over, but I've now used all the map for "forest nodes". A couple of small " in between spaces" are left. I will build there as next. Than I have to steal ground from the forests. I suppose this will be the town, not from milk and honey but from fish and honey.

First picture, year 31

It's a fast population growth at the moment, 400 inhabitants.

Sorry @RedKetchup for misusing your lovely fishponds this way. It's a reminder that you wanted to take away the possibility to build the ponds in the mountain like this. These fishermen are typical young males; competing who makes the most daring actions. I only hope that the water is deep enough and that they could swim. Otherwise there will soon be a: "XXXX the fisherman drowned"

Second picture, year 34

536 inhabitants, fast growth, easy game.

I like your fish ponds, they remind me of old limestone quarries in southern Indiana. Back when I was at university we used to go to them to swim. The water in some places was far below the clifftops, a 50 or 60 foot drop straight down. The more testosterone-laden of us would dive off of them (the water was quite deep). I never did that, cause I ain't that stupid.

This is not a very interesting game. It will last some time. I play a few years from time to time. That's quite nice, but I don't get really caught by it, as I sometimes do.

This time I will only show you a couple of pictures.

First picture, year 39

You can see my strategy; how I steal space from the outer parts of the forest circles.

Second picture

Same time, same strategy, another area, with food graph. It's too easy to achieve a graph like this. The one challenging thing is to build enough, but not too many stores.

Third picture

Same time, next area. This time with the population graph. It looks pretty much the same as the food graph. It's obvious that it's like that. I try to keep at least 80% of the adult population occupied as producers or vendors. As the population grows the food production grows to the same amount.

so i kinda need to take out and delete the fact they can be built on mountain ground ? thats what you are telling me ? lol

Quote from: RedKetchup on November 25, 2015, 12:44:00 AM
so i kinda need to take out and delete the fact they can be built on mountain ground ? thats what you are telling me ? lol

Only if you find that it's a real misuse of the ponds to build them that way. You know, people like me, who likes to experiment to get the most efficiency out of the buildings, will always try stuff like that.

You have said in other threads that you find it ugly, don't you? And the best way to prevent that, is to take away the possibility to build them that way. Personally, I find them beautiful on the flat ground, not quite so beautiful, but still acceptable in the mountain. To me they could stay the way they are.

There is another thing I would rather see changed with the ponds; the possibility to put 4 fishermen into them. It makes them much too powerful. In this settlement fishers get the double amount of food on the same space, compared to the apiaries. 2 fishers would still be good for that small space.

@Nilla I really like the way you have blended the use of forest circles with NMT. It looks very nice.

@RedKetchup I'd just leave the ponds the way they are. If people wish to abuse them ;) ;D ;D ;) that's their business.

too much efficient for that space ?
i can still let the 4 fisherman and lower the efficacity by making the 'radius circle' bigger because the efficacity always depends of the number of tiles of water , % , inside that 'radius'.
bigger the circle would be, more "non-water tiles" we will get in that radius, then lower the number of fish per catch we will get.

Quote from: RedKetchup on November 25, 2015, 07:40:18 PM
too much efficient for that space ?

I mean:
a good fishpond size 8*8 with 4 workers makes about 2400 food each year (600 for each worker)
a good apiary same size with 2 workers makes about 1200 food each year (600 for each worker)
a field same size with one farmer makes 450 - 500 food each year (if you count the road or not)

I find it OK that a worker in a building (cost materiel and work to build, is harder to remove....) produces a bit more than a farmer, but I find it overpowered that you could produce so much food on a small space, as you can at the fishpond. I suppose you could let each fisher produce less, but I would prefer 2 fishers that each produce as much as they do today. Besides I don't think it would look nice if the water surface of the pond was smaller.

First picture, year 42

Just passed 1000 inhabitants. Production numbers of fishpond and apiary.

Second picture, year 42

I will start to "urbanize" the forests one by one. Starting with this in the southwest. The area will be filled with fishponds, apiaries and houses. Of cause there are also stores, but you can't see them, because they are the first floors of some buildings. It's most meat stores with fish and some honey and very little meat. They are filled fast, opposite to the fruit stores. You can see a few small barns, but they are always more or less empty, never more than 50 fish, 20 honey and 4 wool or something like that. The vendors are very diligent.

I will probably get a lot of problems with the health. I have noticed that in many of the houses, even in those that are next to the fruit store, they have only fish to eat. This is the disadvantage with the specialized stores; When people need food, they grab the first they could get. Most of the people in this corner are fishers. They walk between fishpond and barn/meat store. I suppose they are more often close to the meat store in the next block, than to the fruit store in the same house as they live. But I'm glad that there are some small problems to deal with, otherwise it would be too boring. The herb stores are shrinking fast at the moment. I will soon have to decide if I will buy some herbs or let the health go down.

Another small problem I had from the beginning is, that there are more young males than young females. I can't build as many houses as families, unless I want the young female students move around the map. I have to keep an eye on who moves into the new houses and stop building for a while, when something like this happens. (Rohann 19, beekeeper moves in with Lorris 17, student).

First picture

I can tell, I have this freeze bug in this game, too. This time no one froze to death, because I discovered the interesting place, before it was cold. It´s a small barn. Everyone from all over the map carries their stuff there. It was full, you can see the boxes of fish on the ground. The tool less person is just standing there, admiring this "wonder barn". That´s how I discovered it. I hope this will not happen often!!!!  >:( :(

Second picture

The first "urbanized" area is done. How do you like this ghetto, @irrelevant? Not so nice, but somehow interesting. It looks a bit like some of these dense, Middle European medieval towns, with its narrow, twisted alleys. Even if the streets are straight here, it doesn´t look that way. It seems like if you get in there, you might not find your way out.

A few more picture, I didn't play much this weekend.

First picture, year 48

Next forest area filled with buildings. Still growing fast. The whole west side of the map is full.

Second picture, year 48

This is a magic store. It's not a "buggy" one. I have demolished another store and some barns, the fish should be carried to this one. But only few of the people use the door. They prefer a secret passage through the wall, or are they ghosts?

Third picture, still year 48

I buy logs, stones, iron, some wool and since lately, some herbs. The queues to the herbalists are long. All herbs I can buy, are gone in a few minutes. Unfortunately I cannot afford to buy as much herbs I need. I have wood choppers enough but three trading ports are not enough to get all the logs I need.

Fourth picture, year 49

That's the reason I've built another two trading ports. I should have done it earlier. The stores of logs are so low that I have to put a brake to my building speed. All wood have to be reserved for the choppers. Now I'm waiting for more big ships with 4000 logs.

Food on the other hand was never a problem: 1838 inhabitants, 1000 k food in store :)  :o

That is an enormous food stock for having no farms and not trading for food. I'm just curious, how much of that food is fish and honey?

I have never had that bug that you keep getting. I wonder what causes it?

To be honest; there's almost only fish in my stores; 860k.  :-\ I just made this screenshot.

You can also see, there's not much wool in my stores. That's deliberately. I haven't enough logs. Not enough logs mean not enough firewood. I want as little as possible of the wood into the trading ports, so the only thing I buy at the moment is logs, and my pastures don't produce enough wool for all my tailors. I've also stopped the blacksmiths, to save logs.

I have changed the plans, I had from the start; I will not have any farming. I couldn't increase the food production that way. I will go on like this a little bit longer, but when I'm done with the original plans, I will start to trade food. Not primarily to increase the amount. I will sell some of my fish for other food to increase the variety.

And the bug..... >:( :( :'( :-\ I have no clue, what may cause it. In my games, it only occurs when I play with mods. But it doesn't seem to be connected to a special mod. In this game I've only seen it once. (the second picture was no bug). It seems like @Trizeropz also have it, maybe he could find something out.

Holy !#@$%, that's a lot of fish. You should plant some potatoes so they can have fish'n'chips. :)

Quote from: Nilla on November 30, 2015, 03:35:12 AM
Second picture, year 48

This is a magic store. It's not a "buggy" one. I have demolished another store and some barns, the fish should be carried to this one. But only few of the people use the door. They prefer a secret passage through the wall, or are they ghosts?

this game is so buggy and the path finding is the most buggy one. cant control them and i think it is not my 'meshes' the problem

I have played a little from time to time but was too lazy to post any picture. The game is like it always was: much food, sometimes too few logs. The big boats seem to arrive all at the same time. No more bugs. The population grows and the game is getting slower, but still good playable.

Here are some pictures:

First picture, year 55

The last small forest areas are transformed. Just one small problem: I was very focused on ordering logs, so I "unordered" stones. The consequence; I ran out of stones.  :-\

I can say that it's not so easy to play without producing any raw materials, without spamming the area with trading posts. But I now prepare the buildings I want to build and when the stones finally arrives, they are finished fast.

If it's getting boring, we will be a little bit cheered up with scarlet fever. The settlement is too dense to prevent an epidemic.

Second picture, year 57

The last buildings are set. 2780 inhabitants. How far will this go? I produce 320 000 food good years. I can say there is a difference if many people are sick (290 000) or if the stores of firewood are small and they have to walk far away to find a little something (305 000). I guess if I use the big stores I could support a population of 3500 at the most. We will see. It's starting to get very slow.

Third picture, year 59

I have started to trade food; fish (and lamb shops) for other food, just to increase the diversity. It's not easy to get it distributed over the whole map.

I'll post some more pictures in another thread, it takes so long to send more than a few pictures at the time.

Fourth picture, year 59

You can see a small influence of the better food, but it takes a long time. As far as I understand; the health doesn't get worse with diversified food, but to improve the health you'll need herbs and I can't afford to buy any at the moment.

Fifth picture, year 59

This is the reason for not being able to buy any herbs; too few logs. To improve the situation I've built another two trading ports. Now there are 8. I hope it will be enough.

Sixth picture, year 60

It's funny, the big boats with logs all arrived more or less at the same time. This is the fourth this year.  :D :-\

The population grows: 3222 inhabitants. The food stores starts to get down. Not only because I have almost 100k in the trading ports. To increase the amount of food a little bit I've started to build a few mills. I will sell the flour at the beginning. It's not a big business but still a little something. I don't think I want to have any bakeries, at least not yet.

I have been absent from this site for some time. Last week we were in Germany for some Christmas shopping and seeing some friends and relatives. This weekend some friends were here and soon is Christmas. We don't overdo the Christmas stuff, but still too much other things to do than play Banished. But I actually let this game run a little bit after our guests were gone on Sunday evening.

First I managed to get 3500 inhabitants. That's about as much as it can get. Not bad for a small map with no farming and almost no trading for food. (I trade fish against other food for variety, I make a little flour from the wheat I buy and very little lamp chops.)

I think the settlement could have survived this size. The stores of food are getting smaller but as I've said before; I produce 280-320 food each year, so I think 3500 people would work. But I will not make a try. The game runs too slow. It's not possible to make it a "self runner". I can't auto trade anything in this game.

So I decided to play until the next batch of nomads arrived and see if I could reach 4000 inhabitants. I was lucky. It was a big "batch". 450 of them! The population had started to get down so I had to use a trick to reach 4000 inhabitants; fake demolish homes where no children could be born and let fertile nomad women move in. (Will this increase the hostility against immigrants in the town?  :-\ )

First picture

4000 inhabitants

Second picture

Food graph. I think the town could survive 3500 inhabitants as most but not 4000. The stores empties too fast.

Third picture

This was the main problem the last 20 years. If you don´t produce any/much logs yourself, you need more trading ports for such a large settlement.

what i do to overcome the food limit.
i produse or buy food and when im close to the limit i store a big quantity at trading posts (if i dont have space or i dont want to use much space) i store food at the warehouse (or whatever they call it.. the "storage barn" with the traders ui...)