Author Topic: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12  (Read 866 times)

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Offline Turis

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #30 on: April 08, 2018, 05:32:55 AM »
I challenge you to a duel. Wild West Online

Offline Nilla

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #31 on: April 08, 2018, 07:03:29 AM »
@Turis, ask @brads3, heīs the cowboy. Iīm the peaceful old lady, knitting by the fireside, remember! No room for me in the Wild West. The same this town, itīs totally peaceful! No militia needed. The most dangerous species are some pigs, (of the breed Iberico), normally feasting on acorns deep in the forests, but occasionally showed themselves in the village, grubbing everywhere; turning our fields and orchards totally up side down. The children loved the piglets, but they are no "good company" ;) But we have good hunters, so the pigs have disappeared. We haven't seen any for centuries, no pheasant, hares, bears or bison eather. The only prey our hunters still can find are deer. On the big map my hunters still killed all kind of animals after 40 years, but opposite to this map, there was some "untouched forest".

Other things that have disappeared are the various kind of berries, that used to grow in our forests. (I don't mind it that way, that might be a reason, that I hadn't said anything before. It also happened on the big map. I thought, that someone who likes this "diversity" would have noticed and said something.) But since you put so much effort in making all these different berries, I guess you want to know, if they disappear in a busy forest after maybe 20 years, @RedKetchup.

There has been no further trouble in this game. Everything works fine. The map is full, I have plenty of everything needed. I realize that I could have supported more people on this map. I have decided to let it run "one cycle". The population has started to get down, I will let it drop and when the population starts to increase again, I will build more houses and also make some other changes. I have some ideas. Since I'm not really playing at the moment, I have a lot of time to look at production numbers and think about possible improvements.

If you look at the first picture; "Love of my life" it shows the output from the 3 forest working sites. I have made some more notes;

4 gatherer; 2500-3300 food and 108-164 firewood (tradevalue 3000-4000)
3 hunter; 320-960 food and 12-36 leather (tradevalue 1000-3200 if you can sell ALL meat but that will not be possible and in this town without trade 440-1300)
4 forester; 320-380 logs and 20-48 firewood (tradevalue 700-1000)

You have started to change tradevalues @RedKetchup. I have two more to suggest:

1. Meat reduced from 3 to 1. I have always thought that meat as export is silly. But most people (including me) sell it. OK, meat may be expensive, but why would a merchant in a rowing boat want to bye fresh meat on a warm summer day and pay a high price. He will soon be forced to throw it all into the river. Let salted, dried and smoked meat be profitable to sell, but not fresh. I would also suggest the "old production numbers" for meat. If you're only comparing food as a Banni sees it; a hunter is far less valuable than a gatherer and pastures less than farms. (With tradevalue 3 it's different)

2. Logs increased from 2 to 4. This would make it less interesting to import all these loads of logs, many people do (including me). To order logs would even give a penalty of 1. It would still be profitable enough to produce firewood and a forester could at least support himself and a child.

Online RedKetchup

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #32 on: April 08, 2018, 08:18:20 AM »
the forest doesnt spawn any of the new food at all, thats the grass that spawn these food. so if your forest get empty of grass... you wont get any of those anymore in in forests.
did you cleared all grass in forest zones by yourself, manually ? or it is your foresters who took care of this ?


so you are suggesting to bring back the meat at previous numbers, and down the value at 1 ? and let the tier 2 meats at their upgraded value(2) if they took firewood to smoke it or salt to salt it ?
about hunters numbers, you need to keep in mind with another layer (butcher/smokery/saltery/drying) you double the amount of meat, while you cannot double the amount of onion/shrooms/root/berries with another layer. So at the end, which one is more profitable ?

logs have still a value of 2..... want me to up it to 4 ? whats about to 3 ?
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Offline brads3

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #33 on: April 08, 2018, 08:42:26 AM »
interesting. so the grass doesn't grow back by itself i thought it was earlier on.since they are connected to grass and not trees,i wonder if that is affecting my gathering. is good to know.

Offline Nilla

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #34 on: April 08, 2018, 08:56:49 AM »
OK, the other fruits spawn from grass; clever! I have seen them on my meadow. I only thought, that they were still there because I don't occupy a gatherer there. Maybe I should try one and see what happens. And no, I haven't cleared any grass manually. (maybe some at the very first forester, but none by the others).

You have a point about the possibility to process meat (and fish, grain AND mushrooms, don't forget them). But I find it more difficult to process meat than fish. I have only dryers in this game. They run very well, if they are located on places where there's always a lot of fish, but the output gets down very much if there's not. With many smaller grocery stores the food is very well distributed all over the place. It will be hard to always have a lot of meat close to the dryers/salters/smokers. Good dryers can produce over 1800 dried fish (2 worker) but I also have some with less than 1000. It's those who are located close to fisher and not directly at a grocery store. It seems like the vendors often are faster than the baker.

I suggested a trade value of 4 for logs because I find it interesting, if it's more expensive to order them. I don't think there is an "ordering fee" on goods worth 3. (but I'm not sure. I can't remember, that I ever ordered anything worth 3 in vanilla Banished. In the North it's not more expensive, but Tom has changed a lot and it might be different vanilla)

Firewood would still be very profitable. With logs worth 2 each firewood makes a profit of 3,5, with the logs costing 4 it's still 3 (or 2,75 if you have to order to a higher price) Your chopper makes at least 300 firewood. That's s till a reasonable profit.

Offline Turis

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #35 on: April 08, 2018, 10:09:50 AM »
@Turis, ask @brads3, heīs the cowboy. Iīm the peaceful old lady, knitting by the fireside, remember! No room for me in the Wild West.
Well, guess what? You can do that in the game. Where's your sense of adventure? Get in the game, find a small plot of land and do some farming.

Offline Nilla

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #36 on: April 08, 2018, 10:21:22 AM »
........... find a small plot of land and do some farming.

And Turis comes to destroy everything! NO NO NO NO! Will never happen!   ::) :P
« Last Edit: April 08, 2018, 10:29:32 AM by Nilla »

Offline Turis

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #37 on: April 08, 2018, 11:13:40 AM »
How did you...  :) :D

Offline Turis

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #38 on: April 08, 2018, 11:34:37 AM »
Forget it. You're imposible. We wouldn't know each other in the game unless we both agree beforehand. But now I realize that if your farm and you were attacked by anybody, you would just come here and blame me even if I'm innocent.

Sorry, but, I'll find someone else to play with me.

Offline Nilla

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #39 on: April 09, 2018, 03:41:22 AM »
Has @Turis finally understood, that I try to avoid games with a violent content? The world is too full of violence. I don't need that to my amusement. Don't get me wrong; I don't find, that people who like most of the computer games are bad persons. I don't think, that it's more likely, that you go out in the streets killing or beating people, just because you like to do it on a screen. Luckily, everyone can choose the kind of game they like, including me.  Maybe the absence of violence is one of the reasons, that I'm hooked here by Banished. Except a few "killing boars" and some mysterious murders of vendors/traders(?) everything is peaceful.  Not even the nomads get violent, if you turn them down. A game for me! :)

@RedKetchup, I have said this before: When I make suggestions or have thoughts about one thing or the other, take it for what it is; something to think about. Not more, not less. I don't expect anything to be changed, just to please me. The things you do has to please you. I know, you are (or at least were  ;) ) a very good player. (How long has it been since you had time to really play Banished?) Even if it has been some time, I know, that you have a good feeling for what will work and also for what people want.

I built that gatherer in the meadow. They find a lot of different food. Since the circle is a bit small, I started with 2 worker. I think that's enough. I now have 4 but they don't make much more. They find less food than in a forest; about 900, but as I said; it's a smaller circle.

I will try to use my "orchard trick" to its limit: I will replace my forests with orchards and fields and produce all the logs I need by cutting orchards. With these dense orchards, it's far more efficient than running a forester. I'll make a calculation, to compare with the forester, gatherer and hunter, that together makes about 430 logs (firewood included) and 4000 food. A forest has a diameter of 70, that gives an area of 3800 tiles.

I build orchards 5*15 tiles. That's 24 trees, each make 3 logs (I think). To make 430 logs you'll need 6 of these orchards. I harvest 1 year plums, so you can only harvest logs every 4. year. That means you need 4*6=24 orchards= 1800 tiles. One orchard use to give average 520 plums; that's about 3000 food. With two fields 5*15 you'll get totally 4000 food. This means you use only a little more than the half area to get the same amount of food and logs as the "forest node". This way I'll have much more free area to build houses and to produce more food and orchard logs.

Do I like to make it this way? No, not really. I like the forests. It's also a bit weird to cut fully functional fruit trees after one years harvest. But if I can squeeze 2000-2500 people on a small map without trade, it might be worth it.  :-\

Do I wish any changes to make this way impossible? No, not really. It's a awkward way to play. I don't think, many people will use this to its limit, like I do here. I have always used orchards as additional log producers, but never this way. I guess this will also be the first and last time I do.

One thing you could do @RedKetchup, if you want to make this way less profitable, would be to return to the less dense orchards. But to me, the main reason would be another: I've always found, that these dense orchards doesn't look good; it's too tight between the trees, it looks too dense to me. I know you made them that way, because you want to make the output similar to a field. It's a good thought, but maybe the better way would have been, to give each tree a higher output.

This game slowly comes to its end: I will play a bit tonight but tomorrow I'll go on vacation. So it's time to try to give the last two pictures their names, or rather try with all my (OK very limited  :-\ :( :-[ ) creativity to make pictures to the names I have. It doesn't look like anyone have a clue on what "game I'm playing" with these weird names on my pictures. Maybe the next will help. I need to explain two words: "bohemian" - a person who lives an unconventional life without obligations; (like idling at a well or walking in rows across the land ?), "rhapsody"; a mixture of pieces, that don't naturally belong to eachother. And since @Turis called me "My fair lady Nilla" a while ago, I guess the natural next step is to say "God Save the Queen" and show you some statistics! ;) 

Iīll give you a "bonus track", just because I know, that @RedKetchup likes nice impressions with his mod. I like this former forest part of the village.


Offline Turis

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #40 on: April 09, 2018, 03:47:28 AM »
But, I'm not like that. Just because I play violent games don't mean I'm violent in real life. In fact, I'm a quiet person and respectful towards everyone where I live. I don't even own any firearms since many years ago. Well, I didn't see the point of having them since I can play these games in my PC.

Offline Nilla

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #41 on: April 09, 2018, 03:49:59 AM »
Thatīs exactly what meant!

Offline Turis

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #42 on: April 09, 2018, 04:10:11 AM »
But, from my point of view, it's the complete opposite. I didn't buy guns from the influence of violent games, but, the opposite, I sold my guns because I didn't have the need of having them. I owned guns while I was in the military, but, not now.

I don't quite understand why you see this as proof of your point. Something must be wrong with your mind. You need to see a doctor. I'm serious. I'm not joking. My mother also has some mental issues because of her old age. She's about to be in her eighties.

Offline Nilla

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #43 on: April 09, 2018, 07:09:11 AM »
@Turis; didnīt you read what I wrote in the first place?
Quote
I don't find, that people who like most of the computer games are bad persons. I don't think, that it's more likely, that you go out in the streets killing or beating people, just because you like to do it on a screen.

But if you mean, that just because you like computergames with some violent part in it, everyone else must as well; I donīt think, Iīm the one of us both, that have a mental disorder. But I will not say more in this matter. I think itīs better to agree to disagree, than throwing insults on other people.

Offline Turis

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Re: Nilla-testing RK Editor Choice beta 12
« Reply #44 on: April 09, 2018, 08:11:44 AM »
A safe world is just a dream and sometimes one has to fight fire with fire to maintain our dreams alive. You're the dreamer and I'm the warrior. Well, not really since you think I want you to feel miserable. I'm just playing around like a kid. That doesn't mean I would hurt you in real life. If I wanted to do that, I would've asked you to join me in Conan exiles. :) :P