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Farmer Effeciency

Started by Biginuf, July 23, 2014, 12:47:54 PM

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irrelevant

@Nilla This is exactly what I do as well, what is harvested is profit, what is lost matters not at all. Up to maybe 16-20 farms I will micromanage the harvest, turning off the farms that harvest fully and re-assigning those farmers to nearby fields that are lagging behind. Beyond that many farms, this tactic isn't so effective.

Pangaea

Thanks for the information @irrelevant. I'll check out the latest update to Sink Mill.

Quote from: Nilla on September 18, 2014, 06:02:21 PM
I make different size of the fields. At the beginning, when I have few people, I make quite large fields for one farmer. (7 or 8*15 is a good size).

I think this way: Some years one farmer will not be able to harvest all, some years he will. I consider the crops he gets into the barn, not the crop that freezes. On a smaller field less will freeze in a bad years, but less will be harvested on good and medium years.

Later, when I have a lot of workers, I increase the number of farmers on these fields to 2, maybe even 3 if i have many unemployed workers.

This is what was my thinking before too, but it got quite annoying to routinely see so much of the crop die in the fields. And I figured that as cities grow big, manpower isn't really an issue, so maybe it's better to save most of the harvests each year rather than lose a good portion in cold years?

irrelevant

#17
Quote from: Pangaea on September 18, 2014, 07:26:26 PM
Quote from: Nilla on September 18, 2014, 06:02:21 PM
I make different size of the fields. At the beginning, when I have few people, I make quite large fields for one farmer. (7 or 8*15 is a good size).

I think this way: Some years one farmer will not be able to harvest all, some years he will. I consider the crops he gets into the barn, not the crop that freezes. On a smaller field less will freeze in a bad years, but less will be harvested on good and medium years.

Later, when I have a lot of workers, I increase the number of farmers on these fields to 2, maybe even 3 if i have many unemployed workers.
This is what was my thinking before too, but it got quite annoying to routinely see so much of the crop die in the fields. And I figured that as cities grow big, manpower isn't really an issue, so maybe it's better to save most of the harvests each year rather than lose a good portion in cold years?
Absolutely. After you get a few dozen laborers/builders, there's really no point in skimping on farmers. At that point two on a 120-tile farm is SOP. Also pay attention to where you are putting your barns, this cannot be stressed enough. Give your farmers the shortest possible walk from their field to storage that you can; that is the single most important factor to maximizing your harvest. My farmers almost all have a barn within just a few tiles walk, and I find this really pays off. Two towns ago I was careless with my barn placement, and I can tell you it really makes a huge difference. I don't arrange my fields the way I do only because I like the way it looks.

Pangaea

Yes, at that point I guess it's better to have 2 farmes on 120 tiles than for example 2 farmers on these smaller 90-ish tiles.

I do make sure to have barns close by, and plenty of them. It can perhaps be improved, especially when I have more open space to play with. However, right now the main problem is that most barns are full, and it's little use to have a barn close to a field when the farmers can't empty their goods there :|

I've actually resorted to trading away food for coal just to get to grips with it. And trading away for example 5000 wheat for 5000 plums and such, to try to get some circulation going. It helps a little, but it's only a short-term solution and then it's back to 100% almost across the line. Perhaps my food has actually increased quicker than is ideal, and we just can't handle all that food right now. I've practically stopped making new fields, and hoping we can grow the population to relieve the pressure for a while.

irrelevant

#19
I have found that the best way to make empty barns is to have lots of markets with lots of vendors, and lots of houses. I don't really care how close together my markets are, I'm not at all shy about overlapping circles. I find that where the circles overlap is the best place to put extra tailors, taverns, and blacksmiths. I also don't skimp on barns near the markets; I think of a barn near a market as like extra storage space within that market. A market with four barns in its circle is a market that has 34,000 storage cap instead of just 10,000.

Also, houses have storage space that is worth considering. They keep themselves stocked with up to several hundred weight each.

I hate to trade away food (except for venison and mutton for three times the quantity of nuts), later on I always wish I had it back ;) Trading one type of food for another type is smart though.

Nilla


QuoteI've actually resorted to trading away food for coal just to get to grips with it. And trading away for example 5000 wheat for 5000 plums and such, to try to get some circulation going. It helps a little, but it's only a short-term solution and then it's back to 100% almost across the line. Perhaps my food has actually increased quicker than is ideal, and we just can't handle all that food right now. I've practically stopped making new fields, and hoping we can grow the population to relieve the pressure for a while.

You don´t really have to trade away the food, You can also use the trading ports as "extra emergency barn". i often do if I buy apples to make ale. Sometimes many food-trades-men come at the some time and you have too much apples in stores. If it is too much it will be carried to the barns in the farming district and block these. In these cases I often store apples in the trading ports, to use later as the store gets smaller (I sometimes do the same with stone and iron)

Pangaea

Quote from: irrelevant on September 18, 2014, 08:23:28 PM
I have found that the best way to make empty barns is to have lots of markets with lots of vendors, and lots of houses. I don't really care how close together my markets are, I'm not at all shy about overlapping circles. I find that where the circles overlap is the best place to put extra tailors, taverns, and blacksmiths. I also don't skimp on barns near the markets; I think of a barn near a market as like extra storage space within that market. A market with four barns in its circle is a market that has 34,000 storage cap instead of just 10,000.

Also, houses have storage space that is worth considering. They suck up several hundred weight each.

I hate to trade away food, later on I always wish I had it back ;) Trading one type of food for another type is smart though.

Good idea with the markets. I will have to put up a few more of them and see if that helps the situation. I've not built a big city before, so just getting above 3-400 is a new experience. Used to think that markets were big and I didn't want to waste unnecessary space for them, if the circles roughly touching was enough. Looks like that is wrong, and I need more of them.

Quote from: Nilla on September 19, 2014, 05:06:06 AM
You don´t really have to trade away the food, You can also use the trading ports as "extra emergency barn". i often do if I buy apples to make ale. Sometimes many food-trades-men come at the some time and you have too much apples in stores. If it is too much it will be carried to the barns in the farming district and block these. In these cases I often store apples in the trading ports, to use later as the store gets smaller (I sometimes do the same with stone and iron)

Perhaps it wasn't the best idea ever to trade away a little food, but we'll see. Since then I thankfully remembered I could store food in the trading posts too, so right now there is 40,000 food there (2 TPs). That helps a little, and getting a bit of circulation from trading e.g. 5000 wheat/beans/whatever for 5000 fruits or nuts helps too, at least for the barns closer to the TPs. What you mention there about the houses is why I put up 15 houses in quick fashion in the farming area. It does indeed look to alleviate some of the pressure.

Right now I'm storing most of the coal in the TPs as well, releasing it bit by bit in warmer days, hoping it will reduce coal snagged by citizens for heating. Really wish there was a proper priority in place here :(


irrelevant

#22
@Pangaea regarding coal, I think bannies actually do prefer firewood over coal for home heating, but the firewood has to be as readily available as the coal is, and also in sufficient quantity. I've done some experiments with using purchased coal to make steel tools. In my case the coal is all swept up into markets (of course ;)  ). I have had a batch of purchased coal sit in a market for an entire year while one blacksmith used it to make steel tools. At the end of that year, all of the coal had been used for tools (I know because I bought 50 coal and at the end I had made 100 steel tools), and so not a single lump had been burned for home heating. I attribute this to the fact that the market where the coal was also had several woodcutters nearby, and so firewood was always plentiful both in the market as well as in nearby stockpiles. Nobody ever had to work very hard to get firewood for home heating.

In larger coal trials, the coal found its way to most of the markets that I had built at that time. I made tons of steel tools, until that started to give me shortages of iron tools (which I was using for trade); I also found that the complex production process (3 raw materials) was too fragile and subject to disruption. I liked making steel tools, early on, up to that point. But after that I stopped buying coal and just bought steel tools instead. I'll always be open to making some steel tools, at least until I can afford to buy them. But I'll never build a coal mine, I'll always only buy coal.

rkelly17

Quote from: Nilla on September 19, 2014, 05:06:06 AM
You don´t really have to trade away the food, You can also use the trading ports as "extra emergency barn". i often do if I buy apples to make ale. Sometimes many food-trades-men come at the some time and you have too much apples in stores. If it is too much it will be carried to the barns in the farming district and block these. In these cases I often store apples in the trading ports, to use later as the store gets smaller (I sometimes do the same with stone and iron)

I do this, too, but not when I'm auto-trading. The silly traders sell off the stuff I want them to store for me.  >:( Usually by the time I'm auto-trading I'm only selling ale and have many 3/4 empty barns spread across the settlement. My philosophy is that I can never have too many barns. I'm also with @irrelevant on spreading markets here, there and everywhere. They keep the barns fluid and keep workers from having to go too far for supplies.

Pangaea

Had noticed that the blacksmiths producing steel tools wander off quite frequently to get any of the three supplies (And often come back with four logs for instance). This reduces output as they're out wandering more, and then there is the issue of citizens hording coal as well. I only have two markets. One near both blacksmiths, and there are two woodcutters there too now. The other market is basically farmland, and coal always ends up over there too. I'm now releasing it little by little, which helps, but it's a microing-nag. Have also bought some hundreds of steel tools, and you are perhaps right that it's simply better to rely more on buying tools and making iron instead. I just have this thing about not wanting to rely too much on trading as I think the mechanic is, quite simply, way overpowered.