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House on fire (and other questions)

Started by kid1293, February 04, 2016, 04:44:36 AM

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Paeng

Thanks for the little houses, I really like the thatched one  :)
Nice addition for variety!

Small market also sounds good - much needed, again for variety... so useful for small hamlets out of any regular market reach.
Hope you find a good balance for size (circle), capacity and range of goods.
[i]Heads are round so thoughts can take a turn[/i]
[color=teal][size=8pt]Editor's Choice [b]here[/b][/size][/color]

kid1293

Paeng: I just stick with the vanilla market specs since I do not plan to build several.

The radius just a little less than vanilla. They have good legs, don't they? :)
Since it is very small I think it should be cheap to build.

Please have comments on this.

Maybe I add in some extra so they can hold non-edibles too.

kid1293

Market (rowhouse 1.02) is up in the download.

I rest my case...

Paeng

[i]Heads are round so thoughts can take a turn[/i]
[color=teal][size=8pt]Editor's Choice [b]here[/b][/size][/color]

kid1293

 ::)
It has been a couple of hours since upload and yes -
I am getting restless already...  :D

But, no more rowhouses for a while, even if I wanted to develop
the Townhall textures into something more. I first thought of
a general store but I didn't think it should fit in with the rest.
So it became the market instead.

Denis de la Rive

Can't wait to try this.

As a designer you can use vanilla values as a benchmark to see if the numbers you assign are doing what you want. For buildings add up the materials trade value and you have a constant to apply. If its a production chain, you can compare work, ( work require x work time ).

If you need help in designing, ( not graphics or coding ), you wonderful buildings, just ask. I have done a lot of thinking about Banished and how it all fits it. I've look at balance in CC, and did the work involved in introducing lumber, ( including changing the values in the code ), so I'm a pretty good sounding board.

I look forward to seeing more of your work, thanks.  ;)

kid1293

Right now I wonder if the market radius = 32 is too much.
I joked about them having strong legs but it could very well tilt the balance
of other vendors.

The building cost is low all over considering they get the warmth of a stone house:

rowhouse 2x5      work 40 / wood 20 / stone 24 / iron 8  (5 people)
cornerhouse 5x5  work 60 / wood 24 / stone 32 / iron 8  (7 people)
townhall 6x5       work 80 / wood 40 / stone 48 / iron 20 (the largest in height too)
market 4x5         work 24 / wood 12 / stone 12 / iron 6 (no large building)

So I think I have some kind of internal guidance of whats ok, but any suggestion
is appreciated!

After all it's only a game :) :) :)

Paeng

#37
Just played a short round with your latest upload (see:  http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=652.90 )...

Wow, you are spoiling us - so many possible variations on the rowhouse, a market, town hall, boarding house (not sure I already found everything LOL)... and everything with F-variants, really cool! Thanks a lot, this is a really neat package  :)


Quote from: kid1293 on February 29, 2016, 07:42:54 AMI am getting restless already...

Well... if you'd ask me, I'd say: Think diagonals!

* For grid-haters like me the lack of items with a diagonal orientation is almost painful...


And yeah, take up Denis on his offer - he's really good with those numbers  :P
[i]Heads are round so thoughts can take a turn[/i]
[color=teal][size=8pt]Editor's Choice [b]here[/b][/size][/color]

Denis de la Rive

Looking at your numbers, I would compare the building cost to the vanilla stone house and adjust factors like number of inhabitants, burn rate, and storage space. You can then see how it is different, and what you want to do with the building. Is it the same a stone house, do you think it has a game advantage, or is it a penalty in exchange for a better function. You could for example decide to reduce storage, or reduce the burn rate to compensate for cheep building cost, or increase the material cost for a larger family size or a better burn.

As for the market, if the radius is the same as the vanilla market then you are creating an unbalanced building with such a low cost. You have many options to balance this, changing the storage, flags, number of workers in addition to material cost. I think that some designers think of the visual look of a building when setting construction cost, but balance is a more important feature in this decision. What you could do is adjust the radius according to % of materials used and the capacity.

The town hall can also be examined in the same way, considering it's impact on the game.

If you PM me the building rsc, I can do some calculations for you, or just post the numbers for the different variables.

I like that you want your work to be balanced, it is an often neglected aspect of modding, and will help you in any way you need.  :)

kid1293

#39
Paeng:
I have thought about diagonals and I think the game would be much more constrained
when building diagonals. Of course not if it had been in the game from the beginning.

I mean that we have no freedom in the diagonals right now so it would be some sort
of compromise if trying to build that way. It would look more chaotic I think.

Denis:
I PM-ed you.

RedKetchup

Quote from: Paeng on February 29, 2016, 12:04:25 PM

Well... if you'd ask me, I'd say: Think diagonals!

* For grid-haters like me the lack of items with a diagonal orientation is almost painful...

at least there is my little smith :)
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kid1293

Agree with RedKetchup.

Freestanding houses should be more free to place, perhaps with more space around.

At first I was thinking about building rowhouses diagonal and I couldn't get my head
around it. The curse of being a square-head :)

Paeng

Quote from: RedKetchup on March 01, 2016, 01:33:29 AMat least there is my little smith

Yes - wonderful  :) 


* Id wouldn't be me without a 'but' - but I wish you would remove the fences...  ;)


Quote from: kid1293 on March 01, 2016, 03:06:13 AMAt first [...] I couldn't get my head around it.

Yeah, I was slightly puzzled by your statement ("more constrained when building diagonals") and decided to let you sleep over it... LOL

The image above clearly shows the opposite of "constraint"... sure, some may argue that you need more space for diagonal structures, but hey - there is a price for everything. And the visual impact of diagonals is quite dramatic in any village, while a total lack of diagonals (everything at strict 90° angles) looks sort of... not natural  :)

After all, we have also "diagonal" rivers and mountains - so it would be really cool if we could emphasize the lay of the land with the occasional barn, shop or home the same way...  :)


[i]Heads are round so thoughts can take a turn[/i]
[color=teal][size=8pt]Editor's Choice [b]here[/b][/size][/color]

Denis de la Rive

I think that single structures, ( diagonals ), to begin with is the best way, you can then take time to see if you want modular ones, which will create important technical problems.

What also might be interesting is modular industrial items that have a decorative function. Things you add to existing buildings, like forges, kilns, chimneys and other mechanical items. The same for civics, and other elements. By adding I mean placing around, not like some of the CC editions that fit in an overlap. Two or three squares, possibly with an idle factor to add action to what is a tableau.

You should let you imagination flow, since you clearly have the technological skills to make most anything you want.

kid1293

I don't want to disappoint you but I'm still very square...