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I am back- Jupitero - The Settlement not knowing what Schools are good for

Started by Nilla, November 16, 2014, 09:48:59 AM

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Nilla

I made a "Banished-brake" a couple of weeks. I just felt that I had played a bit too much. I had tested a lot of mods, mostly very nice, fitting well and filling some "left space" in the game. I wouldn't like to play without them. But somehow I felt, the game wasn't really challenging anymore.  :-\

This weekend (really nasty autumn weather here in Sweden) I wanted to play Banished again. I looked through all the mods, I could find, in order to find one that change the gameplay. There are not many. But I tried one; Gordon Dry - one year is one year. I also wanted to try @JamieIdle2.0 Specialized Tradingports and @RedKetchup Medieval Buildings.

What can I say:

one year is one year - It is a mod for someone who wants to play a real slow game. A child starts school at 6, finishes it at 11. If there is a free house it moves out and lives there alone until it is about 15. Than it starts a family of its own. It takes a long time. Not a game for me.

Specialized trading ports - had a too small population to really test it, but they seem to be an interesting thing, will sure try it again

Medieval Buildings - typical @RedKetchup- mod, nice, surly want to use it again


This first game after my brake wasn't very satisfying. Somehow I want a challenge, something I am not sure I can make. If someone remember; I once asked if it is possible to increase the demand for food (and maybe also other supply) but there didn't seem to be a big interest. Than I suddenly realized; There is no need for any mod to make the game harder. You are not forced to build any schools. If you don't, the game will for sure be harder!  ;D

So I started a new game this afternoon. A big map for once. I use all my favourite mods. But I will not build any schools!

I have played a couple of years- 3 weeks not playing and I pressed the wrong screenshot-button. No map, no figures. :(  ???
I will show it next time. I will also think a bit about, what my goals and strategies are and maybe tell you a bit about that. too.

Anyhow I am pleased to say, the first merchant (vanilla trading port I am too stingy to build a specialized port for animals and crops) brought cows! :)

I really look forward of this game :)

irrelevant

This is a very interesting idea. I'll be watching your progress for sure. Something is needed to increase the challenge!

Beautiful ground for the start.

Nilla

Went on playing a couple of years yesterday. I am in year 13 and even though I still have some original educated banished people, I sure notice the difference.

I have been thinking about goals and strategies, but I really do not have any other goals than to see if it is possible to build a larger (1000+ settlement) without schools. I will not build very dense, rather several small specialized villages around small markets. South of my starting village, there will be a pasture village and in the west a farming village. I didn't build a specialized trading port, but the two first merchants brought cows and plum seeds (without any saving tricks). Some crop seed would have been even better, but plums are good enough.  :)

First problem (rather unexpected); clothing. Not the tailor, she was educated and if you have only 30 Bannies, even an uneducated tool-less person could make the few clothes needed.  There is no leather. I have two hunting cabins (OK not perfect located, but I wanted everything close at the start). I am not sure that these uneducated hunters really find less animals or miss too often, but it would somehow be logical. But from the few deer they really shoot, these clumsy, ham-handed fellows only get 4 leather and 160 meat (6/200 if they are educated). And that is not enough. I have to build one (or better) two more hunting cabins. ::)

Second (more expected) problem; tools. But I didn't really expected it so soon. One uneducated blacksmith cannot support 80 people with tools! I had planned to build one "in town" anyhow. But it had to be soon. I had just finished the town hall and was about to build a big market in front of it, as this problem became big. This will be my small "citycenter "with some nicer homes, church.........and first of all..... a blacksmith.

Third (very expected) problem; building materials. As always, I want to build too much. I have started to build a specialized raw material trading port. I hope it will improve the situation.

First picture: farming area with all the plum trees (no more seed merchant has visited the settlement)  :(

Second picture: here in life the weather forecast tells from snow tomorrow. So I will try to get used to the thought with this picture of my almost ready second Medieval blacksmith at the city center.

irrelevant

I had an uneducated hunter for awhile in my Mountain Men town. He was the worst. Less venison isn't that big a deal, but the big hit to leather harvest is very troublesome.

rkelly17

Back in the day there was a challenge with only stone houses and no schools (I think on the SRS forum???). It was absolute agony. No matter what I did my blacksmiths were just too stupid to keep up with the tool demand even when I had plenty of iron and logs. Not an experience I care to repeat.

Nilla

yes; only stone houses, it will be here as soon as possible, too (and a few of the nice @RedKetchup 2-stories houses). The woodcutters are not exactly high productive ;) same as toolmakers and tailors............

......... tools........?

this will help.........

as long as there are any things you can spare, possible to sell, but this is a bit of a problem, no one is very productive.........

like it  ;D

By the way; do you see the ships. In this game they arrive to the port from left, sell their stuff, make a turn, notice after a while that they made a mistake, turn and pass again (but this time without stopping at the port). I have heard of this bug but never seen it before.


Nilla

So, my uneducated workforce went on to"torment" me yesterday. The whole day! Couldn't leave them. It is a challenge to play without schools. That's for sure!  ;D

Except for food, (my main priority all the time) I am short of something almost all the time. If it isn't clothing, than it is tools and if not tools, than firewood. ...........Yes, the merchants bring a lot of goodies, all the time........

but.........

you have to have something to sell if you want to buy. It is not easy to be poor. Not in life and not in Banished.

I have one vanilla-trading port, and 3 specialized trading ports (2 food, 1 raw materials) but I cannot really fill them with goods to sell. At the moment I don't really have to import food for my population to eat, but I wanted to start an export industry with ale, pie and cheese/yogurt. But I have to use most of my export goods to buy stones, iron, logs and wool. I have thought about starting quarries and mines, but I find them unproductive with educated workers, so I don't think there will be much stones and iron with these guys. I'll rather let them work on the fields (although they only produce 5 food instead of 7 on each square)

It is slowly getting better. I ordered wheat seeds and  have started a pie-production. It seems to be very profitable. I am not so sure about the input, but even my uneducated fellows, can produce a decent trading value.

I got plum seeds from one of the first merchants and have a lot of orchards, so I produce some plum-ale, but have to buy some apples for the pie. I have decided to change this to cherries for both. Just ordered some cherry seeds. I prefer cherries to apples, because I might also use some for yogurt. At present it seems like my uneducated workers produce very little yogurt, so maybe I will hold on to cheese.

One more difficulty is to know how many houses you should build. With educated workers you can relate to the number of families. (houses=families if you want to expand fast, 20% below for a comfortable growth, if you have more than about 50% more families than houses, there might be an over aging problem) It is different with uneducated people, who start to reproduce at the age of 10. !! The population growth is still uncomfortable high, although there is about 50% more families than homes.

pic1, year 19
Farming area, got some pepper seeds

pic2, year 19
Pasture area and "citycenter"

pic 3 year 20
"Citycenter" in winter. The foodgraph looks OK. I have increased the farming a lot the last years.

pic 4 year 21
What will be built here?

pic 5 year 22
Answer; a clothing center with @slink textile market, some tailors and later, when I have enough stuff to sell, a rawmaterial port.



rkelly17

Quote from: Nilla on November 17, 2014, 09:34:05 AM
By the way; do you see the ships. In this game they arrive to the port from left, sell their stuff, make a turn, notice after a while that they made a mistake, turn and pass again (but this time without stopping at the port). I have heard of this bug but never seen it before.

Yes, several of us have experienced this. It seems to happen on maps where the river takes a 90 degree turn just as it enters the map and then another turn toward the middle of the map. The merchants go back until just before they would exit, then turn around and head to the "normal" exit. If you have enough TPs you do get some nice two-way traffic on the river.

irrelevant

Very nice town, you're doing well with the uneducated handicap.

I find that pies are my new first-choice trade good.

I notice that you have a number of professions where you (apparently) have the default number of workers assigned to each structure, but have fewer workers assigned overall (gatherers, fishers, hunters, herbalists, traders). I find when I do this I nearly always end up with some worker assignments that I don't like. But you are such a sharp one, I have to wonder if you have some reason for doing it this way that I have not considered?

Nilla

Thank you @irrelevant, it's nice to here such compliments from the master himself :)

I like this game. The uneducated handicap compensates well for the benefits you get from the mods.

The pie-production certainly saved the day. The last years are running very good. Compared to other trading goods, I find them a bit too powerful. It is OK, that they pay much, you need 3 different ingredients and one, that has to be processed before it is used. But the productivity is very high, also with my uneducated workers (or didn't you make a uneducated handicap there @RedKetchup?)

How much flour/pie do your workers produce @irrelevant ?

To your question about the number of workers. Sometimes I do change the number of workers from the default values, but I am mostly too lazy. But it is correct, that I seldom use the maximum workforce. (In this game I have much more than usually ;) ) Two main reasons;  First; If my observations are correct, it seems like if two workers on the same site don't produce the double of one. It is more like if one worker produces 100, two produce 180, three 240 and four 280 or something like that. With a limited workforce, you get more, if you build more productionsites. Second reason; If I suddenly see, that I am short of something, I can easily increase the production, without building anything. Instead of my normal 2 fishers in a hut, I can put in 4 and produce much more fish fast (not double but still much more).

Pic 1 year 31
YES!!!

Pic 2 year 31
Not so nice, was too occupied by the tool-issue to notice, but I suppose there was an early frost. The wheat is normal, so I suppose pepper is more wounderable

Pic 3 year 33
Tools graph and my second bakery area

Pic 4 year 33
Firewood graph and my cherry- ale area

Pic 5 year 33
Food graph, my first bakery area and a part of my forest area

Pic 6 year 33
Population graph and the completed clothing area


Nilla

Thought I would reach the 1000 population but the game is a bit hard to me at the moment.  :-\ ;D

irrelevant

Quote from: Nilla on November 19, 2014, 02:07:56 PM
Thought I would reach the 1000 population but the game is a bit hard to me at the moment.  :-\ ;D
Yikes, fire and disease! Cholera is a nasty one.

Life in Jupitero certainly is interesting! ;)

JamieIdle2.0

@Nilla I have been considering a mod that adjusts the standards crops so that each one has different yields. Right now Wheat and Pumpkins will produce the same amount per field. So making each crop more variable ie some crops produce higher yields some lower will add a planning and challenge aspect you might like. Also considered increase food needs. The way it is now all you need is 1 Vegetable, 1 Fruit, 1 Protein, and 1 Grain crop. The rest are redundant as far as I can tell.

Nilla

I am not so sure of the consequences, if the different crops only gives different yield. You would only choose the one that gives the most and that's it! Of cause it would be another thing, if you make them different sensible to bad weather. The ones with a high yield, also need a longer time to give the full harvest. Those who gives less are more insensitive. That could be an interesting tweak.

Maybe you could open a new thread about this subject. It would be interesting to hear what other people are thinking about it as well, and it is easier if has its own thread.

By the way I could tell you I reached the 1000 population yesterday. They recovered fast after the "big death" (In Sweden we have a way to express a choice between two unpleasant things; You have to choose between plague and cholera. This time it was cholera, about 200 dead). In fact the recovery goes too fast. Suppose the big crash will come, just a matter of time. Food is not a problem yet, but I feel uncomfortable, because I cannot increase the stores anymore. It seems, almost like no matter what I do the population grows faster than the production. If I build new farms, the farmers cannot live too far away so I also have to build new houses and that means more people. Difficult !!!! ;D

The pictures show some figures and graphs and my latest farm extensions


rkelly17

Quote from: JamieIdle2.0 on November 20, 2014, 01:25:06 AM
@Nilla I have been considering a mod that adjusts the standards crops so that each one has different yields. Right now Wheat and Pumpkins will produce the same amount per field. So making each crop more variable ie some crops produce higher yields some lower will add a planning and challenge aspect you might like. Also considered increase food needs. The way it is now all you need is 1 Vegetable, 1 Fruit, 1 Protein, and 1 Grain crop. The rest are redundant as far as I can tell.

Did not @RedKetchup do a "crop tweek" mod for @irrelevant awhile back? I'm pretty sure I'm using it, but I don't have the game on at the moment.