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Suggestion: Production bldgs should store produced goods

Started by Yandersen, January 27, 2017, 12:51:13 AM

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brads3

i agree that the forester sets could use some work,especially with expanding ideas and adding more items to gather. i have been thinking and in discussions to change some of this. however going back to the original post,i think the YANDERSEN's argument or request is that it doesn't have a storage and the bigger the building the less space to collect from.yes i think a 1x1 tree stump could be set as a forester. and then what a cellar for storage?a  1x1 pile? i don't think there is a good fix to his original point. ther best way so far seems to be to set a storage in the middle of several forest circles.i use the emporium centered in between 3 or 4 forest and hunting circles. then add a couple log cabins and a wood cutter. the emporium being a market locates tools and clothing and other food and brings it to the foresters,etc.

Yandersen

Brads3, we always allocate a stockpile near a Forester Lodge - that is basically all the foresters in Banished need in order to work. Therefore making a special SCALABLE stockpile able to employ Foresters and providing the working range seem to be the way to go?.. Possible?

Yandersen

#17
I was messing around with CutterYard today, trying to add it some storage for the Firewood it produces. In order to achieve this I took a Tavern as an example - this is an only building storing both the input and output materials. At first glance, there was a success. The trick is simple:

1) Add "storagelocation" declaration to the CutterYard.rsc here:
ComponentDescription resource
{
// how often to update
UpdatePriority _updatePriority = Fourth;

// declare types that will be used
Description _descriptions
[
"ui",

"map",
"zone",
"toolbar",
"createplaced",
"decal",
"model",
"picking",
"highlight",
"interact",
"storage",
"work",
"statusicon",
"tracker",
"ambientemitter",
"Common.rsc:fireWoodBuilding",
"particle",

"statemachine",
"cleararea",
"workplace",
"build",
"destroy",
"storagelocation",
"consumeproduce"
]
}


2) Insert the definition of abovementioned declaration somewhere in CutterYard.rsc:
StorageLocationDescription storagelocation
{
RawMaterialFlags _storageFlags = Fuel;
}


3) Add the Fuel resource to the declared storage flags:
StorageDescription storage
{
RawMaterialFlags _storageFlags = Wood | Fuel;
bool _areaBasedLimit = false;
bool _available = false;
int _volumeLimit = 1000;
}


And voila - the Woodcutters store the produced firewood right at the CutterYard. But... Eventually an issue arises: once the volume limit (1000 by default, or 250 Firewood) is reached, then the woodcutter can not bring and store any more log: he picks 9 logs from the nearest stockpile, transfers them to the CutterYard, then walks back to the stockpile with the same 9 logs in hands (because the inventory of CutterYard is filled with firewood and does not have any more room for the input material). As the result, once the inventory is filled the production halts, even without hitting the desired production limit.
I understand, it is not a bug, technically. But this "discovery" suggests that any building storing the output product may run into such problem - I mean, Tavern is probably subjected to this bug: if Alcohol is produced faster than consumed (export-targeted setup) and cap is set high, then once the produced Ale will reach the Tavern's volume limit (300) the production at that building will halt.

Well, looking at the CutterYard building model it seems like it has a stockpile of Logs rather than Firewood. Maybe it can serve as a specialized Log storage then?..

UPD: indeed, it can actually serve as a specialized stockpile for wood! The benefit is that the Woodcutter always has a surplus of raw material at hand which saves him some running-around time (if the Forester Lodge is close so the wood is stored there).  :D

brads3

will a market or even a firewood cart ner by or just outdside the circle help solve this??or wont they take the firewood? the other problem i see is if u was maxed on firewood and now the cutter filled up on logs he would become stuck. he couldn't produce firewood at all then. might not be a problem with 1 cutter but in a game where u have different cutters here n there it would. i have gotten workers in a stuck mode for different reasons and in game u do not notice it until you get real low on something.

Yandersen

Obviously it would. But there is no guarantee. In my case there was no market, so only the housers could take that firewood out. Plus there is a coal flagged as fuel as well, right? So it can clutter the storage the same way.
Therefore my verdict: for the CutterYard it makes sense to make it store the log only, not the final product. Maybe storing log at the Forester Lodge is achievable in a similar way, but the vanilla model suggests it to serve as housing rather than storage. Maybe building log-storage-able CutterYard close to the Forester Lodge makes sense, but I rather prefer the smaller model for the CutterYard. Like in Chop Wood mod.

Tom Sawyer

Great you start modding with this issue @Yandersen. A cutteryard with storing logs sounds not bad. A side effect is probably that the cutters get help by laborers carrying logs to this workplace. Would be an advantage to the small variants. But I also prefer the simple workplaces for chopping wood. And it should not get too much capacity. In general logs are a resource stored visible on piles.

To work as storage location for the resources which are produced at this place makes no sense as you found out. It will always block the raw materials and it has to be stored to be processed. Taverns are an exception because self destructing alcohol. Maybe better to try it with the gatherer shelter where nothing is produced and where storing would make sense. Would be interesting.

brads3

"obviously it would." hmmmm how long you been playing banished and how long you been modding?? the game has a tendancy to do weird things. as TOM said the idea if some circumstances might work better. my CC has a dock set with sheds for wood finder,storage, and a firewood stoage.
i use the firewood shed near a small chopper to keep my firewood dry. the woodfinder is good to pull logs to a sawmill. since you need housing for the forester and hunter,would a hnting lodge for storage and a modular 2nd floor for housing solve this??yes it still is a footprint in the forest but it could be set just outside the circles.

RedKetchup

LOLz i think i ve just got an idea .... very OP lol
making it presently.......... ^^
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RedKetchup

#23
3 models :) 1x1 tile, 1x2 tiles and 1x3 tiles ^^ (500,1000 and 2000 weight.) each firewood weight 4. so 125, 250 and 500 firewood. Ghosted.

http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=1438.msg27428#msg27428

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Yandersen

I would be more glad to see the vanilla' CutterYard remodeled, if u can, RK - remove fences, decorative small barn and 2 extra chopplaces. The ChopWood mod is good, but seem to be slightly cheaty - once the villager brings 9 logs he has to place it somewhere, otherwise the produced firewood appears to be created out of the air. I mean, the model should have some small log pile, not just a single stump on empty space. Let it be 2x3 or 2x4 including the road, let it have a storage of 500, let's say, for Wood, and look like the one in the attachment:

RedKetchup

#25
Quote from: Yandersen on February 01, 2017, 01:29:03 AM
I would be more glad to see the vanilla' CutterYard remodeled, if u can, RK - remove fences, decorative small barn and 2 extra chopplaces. The ChopWood mod is good, but seem to be slightly cheaty - once the villager brings 9 logs he has to place it somewhere, otherwise the produced firewood appears to be created out of the air. I mean, the model should have some small log pile, not just a single stump on empty space. Let it be 2x3 or 2x4 including the road, let it have a storage of 500, let's say, for Wood, and look like the one in the attachment:

what you ask will give just a new look, the problem will still be the same as the vanilla. a building cannot do 2 differents things in same time. yes it has a storage location cause it needs to put the log in. the firewood is not produced from thin air, it is made from logs. and you cannot store the firewood there cause he will fill it 100% with firewood and not have any place left for the logs.

this is why i offered you an alternative : a place you can store your firewood in exactly the same place where is the chopper and give you the illusion of exactly what you asked : allow the chopper to store firewood in same time :)
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brads3

RED you are impressive.once again you have done the impossable.
  the only way to kinda do what YANDERSEN asked,would be to take away the shed and add a specialized log pile in its place.definetly solves the overstock issues. i can see this idea being useful for many buildingspossably a small grainary to put near mills,etc. am i correct in thinking the chopped wood is decorative and won't look empty?? who has the codes for the specialized storage,those might fix that. i wish all our firewood stacked so nicely as this mod.

Yandersen

#27
Well, we already came to the conclusion that produced product can not be stored in the production facility that has input product. Only the input product can be stored, and only in case if input is single. I am pretty sure the buildings like Forester lodge or Gatherer Hut can act like barns or stockpiles without a problem, but I would rather have smaller buildings. If the model is small, containing only the actual functional part, than it makes sense to allocate a barn or a stockpile right next to it. But if it is unreasonably huge like vanilla versions, than absence of model-suggested functionality makes no sense. In controversy, when a woodcutter in Chop Wood mod visits the stump with 9 logs in hands and then start chopping, then it is a bit weird to click on the stump and see logs in stock. The output firewood is on the ground, so it is fine, but the log just disappears. That is why I suggest to extend a ChopWood model with an extra couple tiles piled with log, just for a sake of some visual realism.

And the input wood storage functionality will also increase productivity if such woodcutter is placed near the Forester - in that case the Woodcutter will work almost continuously.

RedKetchup

Quote from: Yandersen on February 01, 2017, 07:39:46 AM
And the input wood storage functionality will also increase productivity if such woodcutter is placed near the Forester - in that case the Woodcutter will work almost continuously.

try it (the little mod i made) you will see it is magic ! :)
if they are full and want to empty them... just click their trash can icons :)
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Yandersen

#29
Yeah-yeah, funny thing. But for those, who care about functionality only. I like realism and beauty. Placing a decoy of stack of wood which contains 0 wood is no fun for me, sorry. Stockpiles are not looking that nice, but they visualize the approximate amount and type of what stored on them. I prefer that way.
Honestly, RK, I do not like your multi-store building approach (c), which relies on players to be fair with the placement. This removes the challenge, IMO, plus it feels too faky to me. And BTW, it is possible to make a house for multiple families - like a Boarding house, but the number of people should be higher there, otherwise they will not multiply.

I am not sure if it is possible to combine Tavern and a Boarding house into an Inn, gathering production and residence into one building, but it is worth trying. If it does, adjusting dialogs to combine both UI seem to be possible. However, my experiments with GatheringHut+StoneHouse show that it may not function, but I am not 100% sure - maybe the in-building production is achievable.

BTW, I just mentioned that a placed Chop Wood stump does not show the building dialog - the regular production dialog type instead. Bug. ::)