Maritimes Pine Set V105

[adelegarland]

I will try one worker in the forester, gatherer and trapper, perhaps that will work.   I've been tracking the resin and sap and I think they are just not being harvested or spawned in enough quantity.

[Maldrick]

@brads3 Was getting a lot of that from the forester when I had New Flora and the compatibility mods loaded but there was so much fur and whatnot it felt cheaty, so I pulled them.  Just a personal preference.  Mostly had it loaded because I like the early grain from wild oats but that's kind of limited with pines anyway, it seems.  In fact, I think I had to use kid's forest outpost stuff to get it, unless the others just weren't reporting it.  I didn't look that closely, really.  Going to keep an eye on it when I get back into a real game, though, because having new flora etc could help a lot if you find that what you're getting isn't enough.  But for now I want to experience this as Necora has it set up if it works for what I'm trying to do.

Interestingly, I noticed in one test that the best performing clusters, overall, had a little bit of everything going on.  Did 5 combos of Pine Forester side by side with all manner of accompanying harvesters and the ones that did best consistently with wood and everything else had at least a gatherer and trapper.  Adding hunters and herbalists worked fine but didn't seem to affect performance of everything else one way or the other.  The lone forester had consistently lower wood output than the others but would sometimes spike up to be on par.  I'm guessing having to clear the harvestables to plant trees slows it down.  So it seems that because of the slow maturation cycle of the trees, the specialized pieces of the set work best at a slow steady pace with everything synergizing.  Very cool.

@Necora Much appreciated, but absolutely no apologies necessary, of course!  This set is great, it just threw me for a bit of a loop (and I gather from the thread I'm not the only one), which I thought I had figured out, then didn't, now seem to have.  Was a lot of fun learning how the whole thing ticks.  The gotcha is that these specialized foresters don't perform the same as most other buildings of the same type for the game, but there's nothing wrong with that, there's just a different balance to it.  Just needs to be accommodated.  And like you say, given the small radii of these buildings, there's a lot of flexibilty available to do that creatively.  I think it's great.  Now that I've sorted it out, looking forward to really giving it a go.

Tavern -- I completely got sidetracked testing the tavern when I realized I had not figured out the forestry, but I did do some more cider and whiskey production on the side while testing that and I was mistaken about the cider...It definitely goes to the tavern.  Tomorrow I'll try to do a more detailed test with your markets and barns since they hold alcohol and see what actually happens.  You are right, luxuries is kind of weird...Ran into a similar issue with EB's winery as a standalone building.  He has it as part of his Apothecary chain and it works great for that, but actually making it consumable was a bit of a challenge the time I tried, probably for the same reason.  Don't think I ever succeeded, actually.  It's also kind of hard to test because of the way bannies just inhale the stuff the moment they can. lol  Actually, I'm not sure what difference having a worker at the tavern will make, unless there's a way to code it to go get what needs to be there....Like a market of sorts?

Since I have your ear, it occurred to me while playing around with all this, if you ever get into adding stuff to Pines again, I think some kitchens that use the new foods would be really cool.  I know the Royal Bakery does some things with it, but some other options would be awesome.  Like a butcher for game, maybe, or something that makes meals with the new foods...Or meals with the new foods and shellfish from your other sets.  In South Carolina there's a low country boil of shellfish and potatoes and I'm pretty sure there's a New England version of that...hazard a guess there's something like it in your neck of the woods?  Or the fruits with milk from Crystal Cliffs.  That kind of thing. Endless possibilites.  Love food processing where you can get some extra volume at the expense of some fuel or another ingredient and where you can bring different chains together.  Especially when you can combine food groups.  Just a thought.

Thanks again...Having a lot of fun with your stuff and I'm thinking its going to work really well with what I've been working on.

@adelegarland

Definitely do give it a try.  I only tested out to about 20 years but it seemed to fix the problem.

Things I noticed, to summarize:  The maturation cycle on the pine set trees are slower than what we are used to, so it takes about 5 years for it all to get up and running and in full swing.  Clear-cutting the area inside the radius and staffing the specialized foresters with 1 worker seems to make things go the most smoothly, although having 3 set to plant-only the first year or so might boost it a bit.  Might be better to keep at 1 the whole time to get it cycling smoothly, also.  Once it's planted, 1 on cut/plant, for sure, so as to not get ahead of the maturation cycle which seems to keep the specialized harvestables from growing at a point.  Having a specialized gatherer and trapper with it, which is kind of the point anyway, seems to give a slight boost to log production.  Having three workers on the set's Vanilla Forester seems to work fine and can be used to make up for the lower log production on the specialized nodes and harvester production seems fine.  Haven't tested the actual volume of production, but nothing seems to get left out like with the specialized ones and seems to be about on par with the actual vanilla harvester.  Adding a hunter to any of these works fine and doesn't seem to affect anything else one way or the other.  At a cursory look, it appears to be the case with herbalists, too, but not entirely sure about that.

Something that occurred to me...Because of the slow growth of these trees, there is a noticeable variance to everything over time...My tests involved building everything at once and letting it run.  Can't help but think that in a real game staggering building each forester might smooth it out in the long run.  Kind of in the same way phasing in orchards over a period of years smooths that out.  Just a thought.

Good luck!  Interested to hear what you find.

[brads3]

it is neat to hear how others play. everyone's style is different. i know mine changes over time as well. good to have reports on how mods function because of that.

              i used to let the foresters get the trees established long enough to get good yields from the maple and apples and then turn the forester off. that way he didn't cut the maple trees that were producing. i use the forever tree mod so my trees don't die over time and fall over. if a tree does that in the forest,someone can cut it . the game just has it disapear.i don't find the furs too cheaty.buffalo hides are larger than a squirrel or rabbit. with RED's training fort tower hunters i can get buffalo. i use the nat div so i have meadows here and there. usually use a tower hunter near the fodder or thatch meadows.that tower hunts many different animals and gets different outputs each year.
        the pine herbalist has low outputs,but i thik it is how i use it. in the forests,since they are so thick,it is hard to check on him.using it near thatch and fodder gives real low numbers. i can see there is something growing that the meadow workers don't harvest.maybe it is roots instead of herbs.the herbalist doesn't seem to gather all the items like the forester and trapper. it isn't a big problem as i have mods that grow herbs to compensate.
            i turned off the CC in some testing games. when i did that i have no thatch growing on my maps.only mod above the nat div showing a conflict is the flax patch for the pine and CC.i guess i should have turned it off too. just was odd to have an issue with those 2 mods. changes the game a lot since not only don't i have the CC buildings but i can't make vanilla buildings either til i get a thatch grower working.

      i do hope to see NECORA come back and do more. the crystal cliffs stable mod can be expanded. i like how it takes corn as feed for those animal pens.would like to see someone add fodder and give us fertilizer as an output too.i have other ideas that might be different too.

[Maldrick]

Had a closer look at the Tavern.

Made copious amounts of both cider and whiskey and allowed them to go into storage....The small barns from, I think, Crystal Cliffs.  Then built a tavern.  It didn't move from the barns.  Build all 3 of the maritimes markets and they didn't stock it.  Thought I had noticed it did before but maybe I didn't and was just thinking that because the descriptions say "all flags" and I confused it with the barns at some point.  Didn't try any other alcohol though.

Next I moved it all to a trade post and when unloading it went back to both tavern and barns.  Built a bunch of taverns right next to the port and the rest of it went there, where it got consumed.

So it seems the distillers will drop it in whatever is closer, tavern or a barn.  I had both at about the same distance when I noticed it.  Which isn't the worst thing...Gives the option to store it for pickup by a trade post for sale.  Or if you want it to be consumed maybe stick it with the distilleries off to the side away from barns.

[Maldrick]

@brads3 It definitely is.  I always like reading your posts about this stuff.  In fact you've helped me a lot on several occasions, including wrapping my head around mod compatibility when I was new and really appreciated that.  I gather our playstyles are probably different but, like you, I love using lots of different mods and getting it all working together.  It's why I still have yet to really sink into CC...I really want to sink into it on its own but every time I sit down to do it I think of 5 combos of mods I'd like to try so I go mess with that.  The modders have spoiled us rotten with so many incredible mods to try new things with, it's impossible to play it all.

Like I said, jury is out on new flora with this one or not.  Going to give it a go without but if I'm getting stretched too thin I may re add it and start over.  Going for kind of a big one with this one but also trying some new stuff like maritimes so we shall see.  Think I should have it all worked out to get started tonight.

Yep, I noticed herb production with pines seemed a little low, but I've usually got herbs coming out of my ears in most games anyway.  Like you set the limit at 100 and you've got 1000 after a while.  If your food groups are solid they don't seem to get used much.  Wondering if the modded trees will change that though.  Will be interesting to see.

Actually, since you mention it, in honor of Red's birthday I decided to add Garden Walls to this set.  Have never played with it and I saw where he's including it in his current project so I figured I'd wait till then, but I'm thinking it will work really well with this.  Will be fun to try out, finally.  I think I've read you are a big fan of that mod.  Might add some different food processing to go with it and some other things.

Definitely cool to see Necora around.  Have been dying to play with maritimes but I'm usually going for a medieval theme so kept putting off trying to work it in.  Having gotten into it a bit its really impressive and there's lots he can do with it. Hope he does.

[brads3]

THANK YOU. it is good to hear i have helped others. that is my hope. to help new players especially so they stay interested in the game and not get frustrated or overwhelmed. the more players the more the game stays alive and the more ideas for new mods.i try throwing tid bits of info in my town blogs off and on.did it with different toolbar pics for a while even.just a neat way to show different mods and how they can be used and work well together.
         CC can be challenging if you try to build all the different chains.people get overwhelmed with too amny different items and have difficutly with the limits.the new flags does help some. i use NMT with the CC,cause RED's buildings don't require the lumber or the building supplies. so you have options to build earlier. usually i start the chain and let the materials build up before expanding the chain.like build up the amount of clay or sand before trying to make bricks.the building supplies takes a lot of bricks and luner or some other products to eep a good supply. there is a lot of different buildings though. oh and all the seeds and orchards and livestock.just as a base mod,it is handy to have. many short games,you never build alot of the chains. i like it for the frontier set,ABANDONED has stolen a better fort and indian set though.you have to watch her she finds odd mods all the time.
      mod order is getting pickier. i notice nowdays i can't move mods as much without affecting another.like i disabled the CC and several mods that went with it,and half the nat div quit working. i had duck hunters who fished off and on but didn't hunt as many ducks.weird stuff happens now and then more since the upgrade. the different mods work together but are much more picky about what order they are in. it pays to keep a notepad handy and keep track of the mod order.
       RED's fodder mod is a super mod. it does flood barns with flowers if you pick them for perfumes.you do have to watch the limits of the misc. if the fodder fills too fast,the fertilizer will stop and then in time the greenhouses.you won't notice it much until you run low on food. the hunter gets used a lot.it can be a cheat if you overuse them and put several close together.to me it makes sence to use 1 near the fodder. i hope in time RED adds to the fodder and gives us a dairy barn that gives milk and fertilizer.the greenhouses help food reserves a lot. with the greenhouses,you produce food all year so you don't need to produce it all just in the summer.this helps nomads too since they have a tendency to come after planting season.