Author Topic: Happiness Testing  (Read 755 times)

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Offline smurphys7

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Happiness Testing
« on: January 03, 2018, 09:47:53 AM »
I want to learn how Happiness works in unmodded Banished.  I have read conflicting information.  I couldn't find anything in the modkit.

Quote from BL_ShockPuppet CC Dev on Reddit from 1 year ago:
Quote
Happiness comes in a 4 flavours: spirit, safety, alcohol, goods.

A variety of each is best. Kralyerg made a happiness ring mod that will show the happiness radius of buildings, you can get it at blackliquidsoftware.com

Remember, mines and quarries will reduce happiness (detraction) so keep your houses away.

Nilla has a thread here
Quote
2. What makes them unhappy?
In a normal game ONLY the death of a family member.

3. Could they recover?
The ONLY THING that prevents them from staying unhappy the rest of their lives is a graveyard.

4. What about..... ale, churches, buildings with a happiness radius/unhappiness radius, food, herbs, clothing, tools..........
In a normal game. These things has NO influence on happiness.

There is information on some of the wikis like This one and This one.

Do we know anything else?  Are there are any other good sources?  I spent my first bit of time in the midkit and what files I could look at and I did not find information.  I am a newbie looking through those and didn't spend too much time on it.

My intention is to make a town to do some semi-scientific testing.  I made a Town to test Happiness.  My intention is to run the town for 100-200 years with minimal changes.  Then add a possible happiness factor and run it again.  I have a save point at year 20.  I use an outside program to crank the speed to x150. 

For example: First I will run the town for ~200 years and check the 100 years of happiness graph.  I will reload the town at year 15 and make a graveyard and repeat.  Reload the town and make a Church, repeat.  Reload Market Repeat.  Wells, Mines etc. etc.  Combinations of them etc.

Any suggestions or changes to the experiment?  Do we have any other information on Happiness?

Online kid1293

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2018, 11:08:32 AM »
I do not have it in me to do such a test :) but I can tell I am curious.
What if, as Nilla writes - churches has no impact - is true?
Is it the same with trader?

Those questions lies warm with every modder. If we can skip those 'idle'
points the village/town will be much more productive. People will not be
miles away when harvest begins...

I have no clue to the outcome but I will follow. :)


Offline smurphys7

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2018, 11:10:14 AM »
Fortunately, the level of effort needed to do this test isn't too significant.  I can setup the town, set the speed to x150 and walk away.  I check in every 15-30 minutes.  It takes about 2-3 hours to run ~200 years.  Already got the baseline done.

I want to make sure I do it correctly.  I am very open to suggestions/changes/ideas.

Online Nilla

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2018, 11:30:44 AM »
Again, @smurphys7; a very interesting experiment. I'm very interested to see what's coming out of this. Maybe the first comparison could be what happens with/ whitout graveyards, long term. Here we can actually see, the difference in happines in a normal game. But does it have any real impact of the game? I would also find it interesting, if you made a run with your other "happines factors" as well in a game with and without graveyards. There might be a small difference.

It could also be interesting to see, if there any difference in efficiency with/without these idling spots. I don't think @kid1293, that people idle more, if there are idling places. If there's no such place, they just go out in the woods. But maybe they will go further, if there are real idling spots.

It could also be interesting to test those buildings that have a "unhappiness" radius; mines quarries.

I guess you have read my blogs about my testing. It's absolutely not scientifically made, just playing and looking at the individuals and graphs. These instruments are quite "blunt". I hope you might see a bit more in a long time game.

Offline smurphys7

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #4 on: January 03, 2018, 11:39:12 AM »
Oh.  I didn't think of considering the efficiency affects of Happiness.  That is an excellent idea.

Right now I think I won't try to track that with these first tests.  It is easier for me to be at the food limit and not do anything.  Then after 100-200 years I can take pictures of the graphs.  Since I am at the food limit the production numbers don't reflect changes in Happiness.  Maybe it will reflect in how fast it goes back up to the food limit?  But that might be harder to see on the graphs.

Once we see the actual affects of happiness we can figure out a way to test the efficiency is the easiest way possible.  Paying attention stinks :P

Baseline testing is done.  Baseline Population. Baseline Citizens[url=http://[url=https://i.imgur.com/CVZolGw.png]Baseline Food.] [url=https://i.imgur.com/CVZolGw.png]Baseline Food..  You can see where I set the limit to 35,000 Food.  Maybe this will show us how fast it rebounds and we can see some affects of Happiness on efficiency, maybe not.  Later experiments can get the numbers for efficiency.

Had an outbreak of Scarlett Fever in the middle.  Some people died.  That's why the graph gets flat in the middle.  I don't think this should affect the testing.  We can still see the ratios of population and happiness.

I have reloaded the save at Year 15.  I placed like 5 to 10 wells near houses.  Running round #2.  I am off to bake some bread and make chicken soup while the game plays itself.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2018, 11:50:30 AM by smurphys7 »

Offline Hawk

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #5 on: January 03, 2018, 01:47:37 PM »
For whatever it's worth, there's a couple mods over at BlackLiquid that might be of interest.

Happiness Radius

Unhappiness Radius

Both by @kralyerg
Hawk

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Offline smurphys7

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #6 on: January 03, 2018, 08:36:35 PM »
Here are Four Graphs:  Sure there are differences but can anyone tell a happiness difference?  Potential options are Base (No Factors), Wells, Markets, Trading Posts, Mines, Quarries, Physicians, Chapels.  I placed several of whichever one smack in the middle near my houses AND had it running the entire 100 years.

https://i.imgur.com/d5dzXI3.png
Happiness Testing


https://i.imgur.com/ayOSvd6.png
Happiness Testing


https://i.imgur.com/TBOtqb6.png
Happiness Testing


https://i.imgur.com/SJ4UCNv.png
Happiness Testing


Sure, one has more clear sine wave population and one had a couple boons and busts but no big differences.  Here's Cemeteries:

https://i.imgur.com/XYLfJdq.png
Happiness Testing


Cemeteries obviously increased Happiness.  Let me know if anyone can pin down any of the four above.  I think I posted the one before as Base.  Don't cheat :P  I think the first four graphs are all the same and running the simulation more times on any of them would produce no discernible change in happiness.  Let me know if you think any of those have altered happiness. 

Online Nilla

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2018, 01:25:26 AM »
Of cause the graph look different. But since the happiness gets down so much when familymembers dies, I think it's hard to say anything about influence of something else. So, even if there is a small influence, it's hard to prove. The only thing I can guess, is how many deaths there was or better; how many parents died, when the children still lived at home. That's the big influence.






Offline Hawk

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2018, 03:31:59 AM »
Can you use the mods I mentioned above and then check the happiness and unhappiness of the Bannies inside and outside of the radius?
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Online Nilla

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2018, 05:37:35 AM »
Can you use the mods I mentioned above and then check the happiness and unhappiness of the Bannies inside and outside of the radius?

I'm pretty sure, that this will not bring anything. These mods only makes, that you can see the radius. And I'm also pretty sure, that you will not see any difference in happines inside and outside. If there is any difference at all (I rather think not but I'm open to proves, that I'm wrong), it's very small and not possible to see in the personal menus. I guess the radius shows, that people who live/are in the circle, go to that spot to idle. But I have never seen, that this idling has any effect on happiness at all. Only the opposite; unhappy people will go there more often to idle, but they will not be happier after they've done it.

Offline Hawk

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2018, 06:47:41 AM »
OK! I understand what you're saying. It was just a thought.  :)
Hawk

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Offline smurphys7

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2018, 07:20:11 AM »
The mods to show the happiness and unhappiness radius only show when placing the building.  Once the building is place it doesn't show.  Here's my quarry example.  I can only run the Mine and the Quarry one 100 years at a time because it fills up all the stockpiles.  I guess if I would know trading posts have no affect I could add one and auto purchase anything.  If anyone likes, I am happy to upload each save file and the base save file at year 15 - pre-experiment. 

To me, it looks like all all the experiments but the Cemetery one have the same range.  The peak of Happiness seems to be about 85ish and the nadir about 45ish.  When population starts going down, Happiness goes down.  When the population begins to stabilize then rise, Happiness goes up. 

I edited the photos and put the population graphs on the citizens graph.  The Base and the Mine Graph looked pretty similar.  Here they are:

https://i.imgur.com/PRurrUS.png
Happiness Testing
https://i.imgur.com/HpPM1kw.png
Happiness Testing


The Mines graph valleys out a little lower, but the population spiked up and down a bit more.  Also, the mines kill people.  Do I want to run the Base and the Mines one again until I get a smooth sine wave?

Here are the Wells experiment and the Quarry:

https://i.imgur.com/sMNxsQq.png
Happiness Testing
https://i.imgur.com/kjOfy8h.png
Happiness Testing


The Quarry spikes down a tiny bit more than the Wells graph.  But is this just an chance?  Is it due to kills?  The Quarries and the Wells were smack in the middle of town.  If there is a Happiness effect from either the affect is negligible. 

Contrast any of these graphs with the Cemetery Graph in a previous which was outrageously obvious.

If anyone suggests I run one of these again I'd be happy to do so.  It only takes about 5 minutes of effort and 2 hours of letting my Banished citizens fly around.  I'd be happy to provide save games or more pictures.

Online kid1293

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2018, 08:00:09 AM »
I don't think food has an impact on happiness. Luke made it little food/varied food
reflect in health. I do not think he added happiness also.

Someone said being without job made people unhappy. True?
That is maybe the reason for idling points. Unemployed don't lose happiness.

Just ideas.

Offline smurphys7

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2018, 08:41:11 AM »
My current plan is to do these all once and then do them a second time with Factor + Cemetery.  The Cemetery makes a nice straightish line and we should more easily be able to see if the line is lower or higher or whatever.

Mine, Quarry, Well, Trading Post, Market, Chapel, Physician, and... anything else?

Offline Hawk

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Re: Happiness Testing
« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2018, 08:45:46 AM »
The mods to show the happiness and unhappiness radius only show when placing the building.  Once the building is place it doesn't show.

Oh yea! That's right. I forgot about that.  :-[ It's been quite some time since I used either of those mods.
Hawk

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My Internet went down for an hour so I had to talk to my family. They seem like nice people