Ideas for Playing the Game Long Term

[snapster]

Albeit my previous thread had a good point it apparently flew over the heads of people. So in deciding whether I should buy the game I'm wondering how specifically people play it over long periods of time. After your first successful town what do you find the point to be? Is every subsequent town or village about a challenge? How many challenges are there, and don't be philosophical please? What are some examples of challenges? Why are they worthwhile?

What do you like about the game so much? Can't one town include all its content?

PS

Is my problem that I think Civilization is a waste of money?

[irrelevant]

This was all explained in your first thread (now locked). Go back and read it again, this time for comprehension, rather than just to see how many people you can insult.

If you truly are interested, your answers are there. If you are just trolling, your response will make that clear.

[salamander]

In trying to come up with an answer, I've found that I really can't pin down what I like about the game -- I just like playing it.  To me, it's relaxing.  There's no pressure about whether the next town over is sending troops your way.  I also like the planning needed to develop a successful town -- resources have to be kept balanced, you need to control population growth rate, etc...

As far as replayability, I do tend to set goals for myself (is this what you mean by 'challenges'?).  At least for the Steam version, there are Achievements you can work toward, there are forum challenges here from time to time where you get to see how others are approaching the same goal, and you can decide what kind of town you want and work toward it: trade-based, totally isolated and self-sufficient, no mines/quarries allowed, and so on.  This flexibility is what keeps me interested.

It might help if you'd say a little more about what types of games you do like to play, and/or why you think Civilization is a waste of money.

[snapster]

I find Civilization a waste of money for the same reason- I find it to lack depth for playing it many times. Most things remain the same, even though there are a few different ways of winning, which doesn't justify the cost for me, and some differences between civilizations. It really is like a board game. I don't find enough value in the little things to go through the same experience.

How far can you carry the "trade-based, totally isolated and self-sufficient, no mines/quarries allowed, etc." list? That's one of the things, the three items you specified aren't accidental.

Funnily enough one franchise that keeps me engaged is Heroes of Might and Magic, but I don't really play beyond the campaigns and some of the single player maps. Enjoy it though.

[A Nonny Moose]

I am very much afraid that this is one of those games that, after you can successfully make a hard level village live permanently will lose its attraction.  It might be saved by the mod kit, which remains to be seen.

I've been playing SimCity 4 Deluxe for 12 years now, and recently reacquired the digital download version because my play disk wore out.

Simulation games are a matter of preference, and these games require something that is not present in the youth of today: patience.

[snapster]

So then we again arrive at the mod kit. How much can the mod kit do? How much do you foresee it accomplishing?

[salamander]

How far can you carry the "trade-based, totally isolated and self-sufficient, no mines/quarries allowed, etc." list? That's one of the things, the three items you specified aren't accidental.

I'm not sure what you mean by 'accidental', since nothing in a computer game is truly accidental.  Starting with three I mentioned, these are some of the goals I've set over many games, either personally or because of forum challenges:

• trade-based
• isolated and self-sufficient
• no mines/quarries
• no meat (ie, vegetarian diet only)
• large population (definitely not something I'm good at doing)
• maintaining a minimum health/happiness level (not as easy as it sounds)
• attaining the Achievements (at least in the Steam version)
• ...

Each of my games with some of these different goals has developed differently.  The list is limited only by the imagination you can put into it.

Funnily enough one franchise that keeps me engaged is Heroes of Might and Magic ...

Not familiar with that one.  How would you characterize it -- role-playing, sandbox, etc... ?

So then we again arrive at the mod kit. How much can the mod kit do? How much do you foresee it accomplishing?

I'm not really the best person to comment on the mod kit, having really just started using it myself.  My take, though, is that not only can you change data values used by the game to modify how things are balanced, but you can also add new buildings, animals, resources and so on.  Several folks here have put out mods that introduce new buildings to the game along with new production chains for producing goods of benefit to the town.  These mods definitely add a new twist to the game, although they aren't able to change the fundamental game play.  I would suggest that you look through the Mods Discussion area to see what's been done and is in development.

[snapster]

How much can buildings be made to do in relation to people? For instance, I'd imagine a cemetery visit increases a person's happiness. Can new buildings have such effects? Then could there be a university that converts a person into a scholar?

Can new sources of adversity be worked into the game? What sources of adversity are currently in the game?

[irrelevant]

Disasters like fires and tornadoes (these can be turned off), maybe a dozen types of epidemic (I had a town lose 1100, or 20%, to smallpox), reduction of individuals' happiness (caused by proximity to quarries and mines). Late frost in spring or early frost in autumn can ruin that year's harvest.

You can add new diseases, make them more or less contagious and/or deadly. You can have new kinds of buildings increase or decrease happiness.

Guys who are less happy do less work than guys who are 100% happy.

You could make trading less profitable, or make the traders bring less stuff. You could make it harder to grow food by making it more susceptible to heat or cold.

[slink]

New buildings can have any of the effects of the existing buildings, in combinations.  We cannot create new effects.

New crops and new animals can create new foods of the same types as the existing foods, but we cannot create new types.  Those types are Vegetables, Fruits, Grains, and Proteins.  We cannot create Dairy, or Baked Goods, or any other type than the four types already in the game.

We can create new types of alcoholic beverages, but they all have the same effect on the populace.  One barrel of apple brandy is not more potent than one barrel of hard cider.  It appears as if they all make "Ale" at the Trading Post, but I think that is my mistake.  I overlooked an occurrence of the description string.

The game is not intended to have adversity other than hard conditions, bad planning, and bad luck.  We can add more, and more potent, diseases.  We can increase the numbers of the nomads that appear on a regular basis.  We can make the weather worse and the terrain less usable.  We cannot add invading armies or packs of ravening wolves, because the game has no combat mechanism.

[snapster]

How much of this can be done somehow? At larger population densities or even just at higher population the chance of disease outbreaks increases. You need university research for mitigation and prevention. Universities occupy some people as scholars/researchers who contribute to a pool of knowledge which comes into effect.

Have you considered engaging the game developer to allow for more possibilities if not to do them himself, at an extra cost for his labor as well? It seems to me there is exploitable potential in this game that should be taken seriously. Why would he be impervious to persuasion to do more work on Banished given how much depth it could have or how much it could be improved by? He can well be more of an enabler than a creator if he so wishes, which involves conceiving of things (meaning he'd have to work with the community). Why would he so want to move away from Banished if the players have identified opportunity? He has said he didn't even consider making the game modable yet he did that.

Here's another thought. The game could have a change from an agrarian society to a more industrial society, artisan society, etc. At a certain point happiness will decline in an agrarian society. Maybe people will start to discover other things and the more industrious, ambitious, or creative would become restless with food levels being adequate, willfully becoming less productive, etc. (so [scripted] events communicated to the player will need to be enabled) Through research agricultural productivity would increase to support higher populations but the town will stagnate unless people are given an outlet. And there could be subsequent changes in a similar fashion. Just a thought.

Moders or whatever they are, the community in a way, will be the creative force behind many directions a single game could go in but the framework for this to happen needs to be provided by the developer himself. There could be many sorts of different things done, whether it's changing societies, one society, one type of town, etc. Then we could really start talking about the imagination limiting possibilities.

I find the possibilities exciting and surprisingly doable even though I may hardly know what I'm talking about. Others need to share in the excitement though and most importantly a developer would need to evaluate things and decide whether he himself would like to participate in creating a game filled with possibilities, if this is indeed possible to begin with. In a way modders would be creating game after game.

[snapster]

Here's perhaps an illustration. What would you, as actual modders, like to do specifically? What do you see it leading to? Can you evaluate how difficult it would be for the developer to accommodate your desires? Big things and little things work. Indeed, the collective wealth of knowledge and ideas I think would amount to something impressive offering much to play. The game itself I envision becoming more of a vehicle for many games than be one traditional game. Maybe 10:30 should be my new bedtime though?

By the way, the basic idea is that on a fundamental level many different things can be accomplished even without fighting. Consider the changing societies example. The change is driven by simpler, doable things.

[irrelevant]

I gave up on 10:30 bedtime when I started playing this game. Normally up past midnight these days.  But I'm knocking off now for tonight.

[snapster]

You strike me as someone who can play many things for much longer and better than me. But you aren't very ambitious and I would say you set a low standard. As much as you might make of this game and as good as you might be at it what you'll do is keep playing it until it dies, and then perhaps play it some more. With all due respect, I consider your username apt. You might be a decent modder though, and that side of you is what I'm more interested about. Surely you've got some ideas?

[irrelevant]

I'm not a modder, just a plodder.