How do you do it?

[irrelevant]

So up to now (and I've been playing just since the end of May, so I don't know every damn thing) when I have been expanding into a new area, I have been marking the area for clear cut and letting an army of laborers clear things out before I go in and lay things down (mainly farmland I'm thinking of here). But I notice that many of you like @RedKetchup, @mariesalias, @Bobbi, @rkelly17 and probably others, first will lay out vast swathes of planned structures, which clearly is the best way for achieving the order and attractiveness that I admire in all of your towns. This implies that you let builders clear the sites. I'd really appreciate it if your or anyone else would be able to write something about the advantages/disadvantages you see in this method, and mention any potential pitfalls that may be involved in doing this.

One big advantage I see in this method is that you don't have nearly the risk of getting your farmers involved, and them being unable to make it back into their fields to plant or harvest. But the times I have tried this it has seemed to go so slowly. Maybe I'm doing it wrong?

[mariesalias]

I like to plan out areas ahead of time. I used to try to do it on-the-fly more but too often I would end up having to later destroy and rebuild structures to fit things in like I wanted. It also helps me make sure there won't be any little unbuildable bumps in the way.

I do clear land still, but I like to do it after I know where my main buildings will be. An advantage of this, for me, is that I don't cut down trees in my future forestry/herbalist/gatherers areas. Once I have my main structures planned out, I then send in laborers to clear-cut the area. If it is a big structure, like a marketplace, or has a lot of resources to be cleared,  I will usually end up unpausing the building long enough for the laborers to clear the land, then re-pause it until I am ready to build it. 

Builders never clear the land unless they are working as laborers. Even with buildings, the laborers clear the land then the builders build. I tend to save bigger clearing jobs until spring when the farmers are in their fields already. I keep smaller building and nearer clearing jobs for autumn/winter when the farmers are done with their harvests. If I do have farmers acting as laborers come early spring, I either cancel the job (in late winter) or use the priority tool on the fields to bring the farmers back faster. If they are farther away, I will cancel to get them back in time for planting.

I don't think there is any one right way to do anything in this game. We all seem to have different ways of doing things. For example, @slink used fields as a way to clear land and plan out spaces. My way of planning and playing has evolved from when I first started playing at release. Some of it is because I found ways that did not work for me (or did), and part of it is because I have learned from other players! There is no harm in trying out various methods to see how they feel/if you like them. Keep what works and discard the rest. What works best for you may not be what works best for someone else.

[solarscreen]

I've settled into a method of expansion that is market-centric. I don't plan the whole map but I do layout what is important for the area I am moving into. I only clear the area first if I need the resources or if I need the building to get done quick.

[irrelevant]

@mariesalias  Great reply, thanks. I don't know where I got the idea that builders cleared the sites. You're right of course. The problems I experienced with doing this must all have been of my own making. So, all in all, this method will be far superior if only because of the control it gives over what is getting cleared and in what order.

[RedKetchup]

i love to sit down and think at my layout and put down building. that way i dont get a bad surprise to see at the end something 'doesnt' fit cause 1x hill or mising a 1x cause river etc.

yes, i think i get more control over the space to be cleared or not by 'pausing' 'unpausing' and it seems to me the job to 'clear a building' doesnt have same priority list than a simple 'clear area' of ressources which is always missing something anyways,
every secondes there are always some ' gatherer fruits' or 'herbs' growing all the time which laborer dont like to clear (if they have something else to clear on list) often by the time and the repeat of order they finally go clear them, more has spawned.

only a 'clear building' is definitive. and also i love how they work, they stay there and cut everything till everything is down, thenafter , they pickup the ressources lying on the ground. I think there is less 'come and go back' movements.

most of time, when i 'unpause' a building you can see all laborers quit what they were doing to go clear the building ground. i use less often the priority tool.

[irrelevant]

Yes! Thanks to you all, I have taken your comments and put them into practice; this is so much better! I can't believe how I was fumbling around before.

Not only is it a better way of clearing building sites, it is far more efficient at gathering resources.

[slink]

One warning about planning on slightly rolling land.  If you lay out a farm field and they clear it, and you then build a road around that, the road will puff up the farm field land so that, once the field is removed, you can no longer build on all of it.  Not even another farm field can be built there.  You might get one or two houses there instead of the four you planned.  So, if you have any doubt about the flatness of your land, don't build the roads before you have the final building(s) in place.

[rkelly17]

@irrelevant, I'm sort of with @solarscreen on how I lay out the settlement based on markets. First I look over the area around the start location seriously and make some general decisions about where to put the early buildings.  I most often start on hard and do a Crossroads forest village, then blacksmith, school and tailor just outside the largest circle (usually the hunters). That involves clearing c. 260 logs from outside the circles of gatherer, hunter and forester before building anything and stone from inside the circles while building. Before building the blacksmith more harvesting of logs, stone and iron has to occur and I focus that on where I want to build. Then I start seriously planning by laying out first market, a fishing dock and first trading post. Once that is all up and running I start trading. All through this time I have to harvest logs because the forester in on plant only. Hopefully by the time I want to trade firewood the foresters are cut and plant. From that point I only harvest when and where I have to and use market circles and forester circles to lay out the bones of the settlement. Normally I let the laborers clear as part of a building project (it is laborers who clear, not builders, and only laborers actually work on clearing fields and orchards even though the program says it needs builders) The exception is stone and iron. In my last couple of towns I am trying not to build quarries and/or mines, so there the laborers spend a lot of time harvesting stone and iron until trading is really up and running. Once I am buying enough raw materials all clearing is done at the time of building. Step one is often to site a storage yard (maybe temporary) so that the laborers don't have to go far to deposit materials.

There is one exception: Before I want to start ale production I might clear the area I want to plant my orchards. Then when I'm ready they go down instantly.

And, of course, I don't always do what I say I do. 

I've also been burned by the issue mentioned by @slink. I clear land and build a road and then what I want won't fit. The little devils can move some earth around when they want to. Now I put in buildings first and roads later.

[salamander]

I'm with @solarscreen and @rkelly17.  I've decided I like to leave some of the original forest in an area when I build, so I let workers clear an area only as big as the building, rather than clear-cutting an area entirely before starting to build.  As far as the pre-planning with building footprints of a large area, I can't really say that I do that.  Like @solarscreen, I tend to build a market in a new area I'm spreading into, along with a house or two for vendors/builders, and then I plan layout from there.

For a forested area with a new forester(s), I'll usually set workers to clear out rocks and iron -- the foresters would do that anyway, but it's slow and takes away from what I want from them ... planting and/or cutting.

[tomplum68]

If you have two plots you are going to build on, doesn't matter what, and each needs 3 builders lets say.  All six of those builders will act as laborers and clear as they are unable to build at the moment until the land is cleared.  The pain in the butt exception to this is if you've put down your roads first before the build shadow is cleared.  Of course, a road to the building is helpful to speed the construction a bit.

[irrelevant]

Whenever I'm doing large-scale planning, I will put the roads down with the structures (while paused of course), but before unpausing I will delete all the planned roads and only redo them after the construction is done or nearly so.

[RedKetchup]

presently, i m in search of a new layout. something looking awesome like @slink but something different since i dont really want to copy exact same thing from another person.

[rkelly17]

If you have two plots you are going to build on, doesn't matter what, and each needs 3 builders lets say.  All six of those builders will act as laborers and clear as they are unable to build at the moment until the land is cleared.  The pain in the butt exception to this is if you've put down your roads first before the build shadow is cleared.  Of course, a road to the building is helpful to speed the construction a bit.

My experience is that sometimes they do and sometimes they don't. At times when I've been frustrated with the speed with which things are getting built I've followed some builders around and they do all sorts of things other than work. They go home to eat, they visit the herbalist, they buy food and/or fuel at the market, they go get warm, etc. Sometimes while I've been following them they switch occupations. I've even followed builders who are idling through the whole clearing and collecting materials phase and some who keep right on idling after all materials are collected and the foundation appears. Lazy little buggers! 

The other thing I've learned the hard way is that if you have laid out a road far away from the current build site the builders will go work on that road and then take forever to get to the site they are assigned to once the materials are gathered. I really do need to remember to erase those roads I drew in just to see where stuff will go in the future.  Sometimes I put in roads near the construction site just to keep the builders busy nearby.

[irrelevant]

I just built a 20x16 pasture in my (formerly) vegetarian town. It was in a dense forest with 66 trees on the site. Construction took three years. I just don't get how that can happen. There were at least 10 laborers living within a market circle of the site. But something tells me that these were not the laborers who got assigned to the project.

Maybe my problem is that that town has too many laborers, I believe there are upwards of 500. Probly time to max out the markets and TPs, that would absorb 100-200.

[slink]

@rkelly17, have you noticed that in 1.03 the dirt roads that have not yet been built require someone to remove them, if you have saved and reloaded since you laid them out?  I believe I have seen this behavior.