World of Banished

Sightseeing => Village Blogs => Topic started by: irrelevant on August 15, 2014, 05:49:45 PM

Title: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on August 15, 2014, 05:49:45 PM
So here's what I'm going to be working on: Sink Mill. The goal is 5000 bannies ;)

Screen 1 - vital statistics

Screen 2 - planning I have done for my first economic region. 10 TPs and the markets that will support them. I'll leave producers, storage, and houses as details to be filled in around this framework.

One thing new I am going to try, based on a comment I read here in the past day or two (going to have to track down who's idea I am stealing), instead of clearcutting, I'm going to lay down farms. Actually I had noticed that this is very effective, as I have made a fair number of farms. But it had never occurred to me to use laying down farms as a clearing tactic.So I have a bunch of farms laid out that are not going to be farms at all. Just using them to focus clearing ground and gathering resources.

edit: oh, well of course it was @RedKetchup http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=290.0 reply #13
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 15, 2014, 06:28:23 PM
Cydnee, the eldest of five children, at age 8 is still too young for school. But she idles at the schoolhouse anyway, looking forward to classes in the fall.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 15, 2014, 07:33:42 PM
Starting to take shape. The farm idea has worked out well.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 15, 2014, 09:32:41 PM
haha i am happy to have been useful to you :)

and so sweet , i see one of those range of seeds being used :) a 8291 :)

Good Luck mon trčs bon Ami :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 15, 2014, 09:50:18 PM
Yes! In the excitement I forgot to mention that I am using one of the seeds that @RedKetchup posted yesterday in the Maps section http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=325.0

 I looked at several hundred of the thumbnails, of those selected 15 that I thought looked promising (fewer stupid lakes and streams) and came down to this one. Thanks so much!  :D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 16, 2014, 12:46:29 AM
Okay, here's the last one before bed. Just after the harvest of year 5. Have 9 families already, thanks to some effective evictions  ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 16, 2014, 01:15:04 AM
cant wait to see your town at year 30-36 :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 16, 2014, 04:50:31 PM
Me too! Lots of work first though. For me, this is the hardest part, year 5-15. Always scraping by on stone, for those first 10-15 houses, never enough to build stone instead of wood.

Meanwhile, Jennith, age ten, recently became a student; his education has begun in earnest.  :o

Seriously though, this is indicative of a serious problem I have. Sink Mill has 9 unattached females, ages 18,17,16,14,14,11,7,6,0 but only 5 unattached males ages 10,8,6,2,2. Going to be a problem, unless I get some nomads. Finally have enough stone for a town hall. I was going to build a second TP first, but I think getting the first batch of nomads sooner rather than later is more important at this point.

On the bright side, it reduces some of the pressure to build more houses!  ::)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 16, 2014, 05:42:32 PM
woot , Jennith is surely soooo happy :)

the males surely happy too ^^ double females for everyone ! ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 16, 2014, 06:00:45 PM
Always look on the bright side, eh? ;D

Seriously though, this population imbalance has allowed me to figure out what "families" means on the town hall statistics panel. At least I think I have.

Mine shows that I have 14 families. When I go through and count noses, I have 11 "married" couples. That means that there are three more "families" somewhere. In my case, these could only be the three unattached female adults, two age 20 and one age 19. The unattached males cannot possibly figure into this, they are 12,11,8,5,5.

So, "families" = married couples + unattached female adults

Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 16, 2014, 06:03:57 PM
go for it ! an adult female will always take a young guy student, and will even start to get babies with him :)

your 2 female of 20 will take your 12 and 11 Young student, and asap the 8 years boy get to 10 , the 19 female will take him \!/
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 16, 2014, 06:05:51 PM
Yes , I suppose the 12y/o and the 11y/o would pair up, but the 8y/o?

squick :o

Still, I need babies, so....
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 16, 2014, 06:06:28 PM
i edited my reply, look back
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 16, 2014, 06:08:57 PM
almost same with opposite gender, an adult boy will always take a female student, but, in that situation, the female wont start to get babies till she leave school, but she will be promised to a man :) and she will start to make that baby the night of her graduations ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 16, 2014, 06:40:46 PM
Well I've got enough resource to build two more houses, so...
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 16, 2014, 09:28:25 PM
The 08 harvest is complete. Food is not an issue for now.

Bought 50 coal. cause that was what the merchant brought. Immediately switched my one blacksmith to steel tools. He already had iron and wood, and is right by the pile the coal went to.

He produced steel tools at a brisk pace, making 100 of them between early winter 07 and late winter 08. That means nobody took home any coal, which is interesting considering it sat in the market for months. That certainly is not what I expected based on my previous experience. I'll have to think about that.

Edited: I bought 50 coal at a cost of 300, not 300 coal as I had stated last night. That's very different.

Screen 3 - revised markets and docks. Got carried away with the taverns; each market also needs a tailor, a blacksmith, and once I get further out, a chopper.

Screen 4 - farms and pastures leading the way into the countryside.

Need some logs! Merchants!

Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 16, 2014, 09:54:48 PM
This is such an interesting town.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 17, 2014, 10:40:29 AM
I've been having good success using the boarding house to get these surplus young adult women to hook up with much younger student boys. You figure out whom you wish to put together by looking through all the houses. When you have identified a likely couple, you upgrade both their families' houses. When all of the "homeless" icons have disappeared, everyone has settled down in the boarding house. Now recover the two empty houses, and one of them should become occupied by the new couple, displacing one set of their parents who now are living in the BH until they get another house.

Did this 5 times so far, it has worked every time.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RavenSteele on August 17, 2014, 11:00:04 AM
Ooh, nice strategy :)   I'll remember that
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 17, 2014, 06:32:29 PM
Early winter 10, had my first death. Old age! Of the four towns I have made, this is the latest initial death, and the first of old age.

I had the cemetery already built, first time for that as well. 8)

Also in Year 10, made my first 3 batches of plum ale!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 17, 2014, 06:36:05 PM
R.I.P well deserved :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 17, 2014, 06:45:55 PM
Two more young men step up to serve their community.

I need nooooomads! Help!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 18, 2014, 08:29:28 PM
Got nomads. Spring 14. Once I get serious logs, this will take off. I'm 30% ahead of Rickettsville in pop at this same time, in a smaller space. Feeling optimistic.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 19, 2014, 07:40:33 PM
A single hunter per cabin works just fine. What a nice resource producer for early trade! Venison, plus leather to make hide coats.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 19, 2014, 09:08:51 PM
yup thats what i do all the time :) 1 hunter per cabin, and more cabins. until i m getting a 200-300 unemployed and then i double them.

keep it up bro (i am so far ahead... just hit 3000 before warcraft raid)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 19, 2014, 09:43:17 PM
Got more nomads. And corn seeds. And lots of apples. And a boatfull of logs. Here we go.

Ah, finally beans and corn.

Late Autumn 17. Not getting much time for this, but having lots of fun. @RedKetchup  sorry I couldn't make it more of a race, your town is amazing.

In the end though, mine will be prettier, and have 26 more people. Until you take 895 nomads  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 19, 2014, 09:48:11 PM
hahaha ya, as always :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 21, 2014, 04:14:04 PM
Forest management. Clearcuttting just after harvest is complete on a four-year rotation schedule, done by start of late winter, in time for the farmers to get back to their fields. Get 2-300 logs each time.

Screen 1 - summer 19

Screen 2 - summer 20

Does slow the herbalist down some, but herbs aren't a problem right now.

edit: after doing this for 6 years, the herbalist's yield finally fell to 0.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 21, 2014, 05:57:04 PM
Screen 1 - With 10 TPs and 5 markets, the Oldtown/Crossriver area will be crankin' it out.

Screen 2- The agricultural hinterland makes it possible.

Screen 3 - Farms and pastures will expand in this direction. Plenty of space out here.

Screen 4 - Beyond Crossriver, vast tracts o' land! ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 21, 2014, 06:24:01 PM
nice, looking good as usual :) so... you just double years (from 10 to 20) in an hour ? you took all the week to make the first 10 ^^ :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 21, 2014, 06:28:56 PM
Right, LOL! No, I've got 4 hours in today. Might be able to keep it up for the weekend, not sure. Wife's work schedule is never predictable. But when she is home, I'm not doing this. Very much. ;D

She thinks it's pretty; I want her to keep thinking that. We had a bad gaming overabsorption episode in 2001 with me and CivII.

Got room on this map for 22 more TPs, in addition to the 10 there at Oldtown/Crossriver.

I can even put one landlocked TP in each deadend corner to pull in building materials.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 21, 2014, 06:29:52 PM
oh ya of course !!!!!!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 21, 2014, 10:18:33 PM
This is where I'm wrapping it up for tonight, with three boats full of goodies to buy tomorrow :D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 22, 2014, 09:11:27 PM
Winter 24 -  Built too many houses. First time I've ever done that. Taking the opportunity to upgrade wooden houses.

Screen 1 - the merchants just left me with pretty stockpiles.

Screen 2 - what I don't have enough of is folks. I've accepted 3 bands of nomads so far (sadly the last one was only 6), sure could use another.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 22, 2014, 09:42:40 PM
hehe no worries my friend, soon enough you ll get packs of 400+ and 600+ nomads hehe :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 22, 2014, 09:55:07 PM
I just got 21!! :D That's 12.5% of current pop. I'm going to start keeping track of this. Who knows, maybe there's more going on than just a die roll.

Summer 25, farms in production
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 22, 2014, 10:20:20 PM
for i ve seen, it s 98% between 8% and 19%
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 22, 2014, 11:54:23 PM
Ending here for tonight, Early winter 26, pop 210

Screen 1 - Port area

Screen 2 - Oldtown

Screen 3 - Farms
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 23, 2014, 02:53:44 PM
Summer 29 - pop 290. Clearing out my stockpiles by building foundations. Then I'll be able to buy more stuff  :D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 23, 2014, 07:53:21 PM
Winter 31 - pop 345

Screen 1 - planned Crossriver expansion

Screen 2 - Port of Crossriver/Oldtown, and Markets

Screen 3 - Oldtown Farm Markets

Screen 4 - planned Oldtown Farms expansion

Screen 5 - Southport on the lake, and markets.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 24, 2014, 08:20:48 AM
yeah :) @irrelevant's play is great he always have an unique way to build :)
me i change strategy at every map. maybe cause i didnt found my own way yet :)

Keep it up, Bro :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 24, 2014, 09:50:01 AM
@RedKetchup Thanks very much! I've learned many things from watching your blogs.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 24, 2014, 05:13:53 PM
Spring 36 - pop 564. Good progress today.

Screen 1 - Farm markets coming in the Crossriver hinterland. Largest farm area I've ever seen. It's why I picked this seed.

Screen 2 - Oldtown/Crossriver ports

Screen 3 - Oldtown farm markets and pastures

Screen 4 - Frontier forest markets will become farm markets when the second port complex is running

Screen 5 - A different angle showing Oldtown in the top right, and the planned second port complex upstream

Screen 6 - A third port complex is planned downstream of Oldtown ports.



Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 24, 2014, 07:30:10 PM
I love the "drag construction mats to TP" trick; a nice jump-start.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 26, 2014, 03:16:06 PM
Late Autumn 39 - pop 869

Screen 1 - Markets at Newport being developed

Screen 2 - Farms at Crossriver Markets are cranking it out.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 26, 2014, 03:20:58 PM
pretty as usual :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 26, 2014, 04:03:39 PM
Thanks! I can't help it  ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RavenSteele on August 27, 2014, 02:36:13 PM
Your population grows so fast!  Have you ever had a town grow this fast before?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 27, 2014, 04:28:52 PM
No, but I never really tried before  ;)

One thing is I've accepted all nomads, 5 batches so far. The last batch was 101.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 27, 2014, 06:27:31 PM
thats helps alot ! :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 27, 2014, 06:39:39 PM
Ahhh....once in awhile you just get lucky with the Merchies.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 27, 2014, 07:24:24 PM
i was getting about the same boats :) minus the wool ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 27, 2014, 07:47:51 PM
Yabbut this was 8 winners out of just 10 Merchies. I never get this lucky. ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 27, 2014, 08:16:27 PM
Merchies!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 27, 2014, 09:14:08 PM
should have called your map : Venice :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 27, 2014, 09:19:19 PM
O sole mio!

Early Winter 41 - pop 1000!

Screen 1 - Newport progress

Screen 2 - Southport expansion

Screen 3 - Crossriver Markets continue to expand
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RavenSteele on August 27, 2014, 10:15:33 PM
Your cities make me jealous :D

No really, your designs are great.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 28, 2014, 05:39:18 AM
@RavenSteele  That's very kind of you. Just form following function, as far as I can figure out what that function is anyway.  :D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 28, 2014, 09:21:24 PM
Early winter 42 - pop 1085

Spent a lot of time on pause this evening, placing buildings. Tomorrow night should see progress.

Screen 1 - Southport expansion is laid out.

Screen 2 - Newport is ready for Phase II

Screen 3 - Crossriver Markets have reached the Lake
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 29, 2014, 06:39:29 PM
Well, I'm not going very fast, but I am having fun.  :D

Late summer 43 - pop 1157

Had to turn down 121 nomads. They arrived just when things were getting a bit squirrelly with food, tools, and housing all three.

Screen 1 - symbiosis of port/industry and farm

Screen 2 - Newport is coming alive

Screen 3 - Southport is as well

Screen 4 - Crossriver suburb Eastmarket

Screen 5 - Crossriver Farmmarkets

Screen 6 - Western Frontier Farmmarkets, this is where the big expansion will take place in the 50s maybe, farms from here out to the left edge, up and down.

Screen 7 - Oldtown, Port of Industry
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 29, 2014, 07:25:00 PM
Ouch! Early frost  >:(
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 29, 2014, 09:06:13 PM
so basically, you only use corn and bean in all your map ? pretty much ? i think we kind need a fix to make all the seeds same :P
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 29, 2014, 09:14:46 PM
Yes. I think I'll buy wheat seed next time it shows up. Based on the numbers, it's better to grow than corn. I need to give it another try.

I think the different growing times have their use. Some crops would work much better than beans on a harsh map. Beans get devastated by early cold or a late freeze.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 30, 2014, 06:11:35 PM
Autumn 45 - pop 1375

Screen 1 - I love farms!

Screen 2 - Merchants departing with their firewood, tools, coats, their ale and their orders.

Screen 3 - Newport expansion
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on August 30, 2014, 09:30:51 PM
with all those farms covering all your sight... how you only have 119k food ? ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 31, 2014, 06:47:27 AM
Lots of those farms have only been in production for a year or two. Before that for 3-4 years I'd been concentrating on building up Newport, and my mouths to feed got out ahead of my farmers  ;) Now I'm back to making farms again, going to fill up the western area similar to what I've done on the eastern side.

Screen 1 - Farm markets expanding behind Newport, agriculture supporting industry.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: rkelly17 on August 31, 2014, 07:16:22 AM
Screen 1 - I love farms!

Holy agricultural extravaganza, Batman. That's a lotta farms.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 31, 2014, 01:07:12 PM
Early Spring 47 - pop 1501

Last year 44 taverns produced 20,000 ale, an average of 455 per tavern  8)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on August 31, 2014, 08:46:35 PM
Late Spring 49 - pop 1716, with 255 nomads requesting citizenship. I want to take them, but I just recently had a big food crisis, three early frosts in a row hit my beans hard. I was gambling with just a single farmer on each bean field, and I got bit.

What it comes down to is, I got excited and was expanding my port/industrial area too fast, and was neglecting my agriculture. If you overemphasize agricultural development, the worst that can happen is that it slows you down. If you overdo industrial OTOH, that can kill you by running you out of food.

Food is good now, this past year I bought every crumb that the merchies brought, but that is unsustainable. I bumped the bean fields all to two farmers and have been expanding farmland as fast as I can. I just don't know if it is enough. I'll probably take them, I need the bodies. But that's for tomorrow, I'm going to sleep on it.

Going forward, for the next few years I'm going to concentrate on expanding my ag base.

Screen 1 - Newport Farm Annex 1

Screen 2 - Newport Farm Annex 2

Screen 3 - The two farm annexes will meet and expand to the west and north (in this screenie that's down left and down right)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 02, 2014, 06:55:18 PM
Early Autumn 49 - pop 2000

Took the nomads, no disease. Ever since I realized that nomads don't need housing (thanks to @RedKetchup!), it is a much simpler decision whether to take them or not. All you need is food, tools, and coats. Oh, and schools!

Food out the wazoo now.

Screen 1 - Progress at the Newport Farm Annex.

Screen 2 - Early Spring 50, coming together nicely. All 225 nomads housed, all their children in school.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 02, 2014, 09:57:32 PM
I've seen screencaps of this, but never experienced it myself. :D

I only put that TP there to drag in construction mats. I may have to stock it now!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 02, 2014, 10:13:34 PM
Late Autumn 50 - pop 2135

Just barely a year has passed since I took the nomads and went crazy with expanding down here; now there's nothing left on pause; guess it's time to lay out more farms 'n stuff (sigh). :P
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 03, 2014, 12:05:19 AM
yeah the TP on a creek i mentionned it at some point :) if you ll get merchants or not , is a bit random, sometimes it works sometimes not.


you have now 2185 Citizen, alot of the map already colonized.... will you have enough space to hold 5000 ?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 03, 2014, 04:41:27 AM
Yes, when I get the map full of farms and houses, I'll go back and start turning farms into housing tracts. I won't need all those farms cause I'll be able to trade for mega-food.

I could probably get this map to 6000 or maybe even 7000, if the performance and the job-assignment issues would permit it.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 03, 2014, 09:41:43 PM
Early Spring 52 - Pop 2285

Newport Farm Annex, Phase II
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 04, 2014, 06:45:50 PM
Early Winter 52 - pop 2505. Halfway there!

Nomads bring dysentery, mumps, scarlet fever, flu. That was an interesting autumn. Also something went wrong with the growing season, not sure what. I did notice that crops do not grow continuously throughout the summer. I didn't study it closely or in depth, but I did notice that rainfall and sun both seem to speed growth, and periods of cloudiness slow or stop it. It may have just been coincidence.

Edit: and dysentery again!!  >:(

Bought squash seeds, going to try a few fields next year.

Screen 1 - Newport Farm annex, phase II
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: solarscreen on September 04, 2014, 07:37:35 PM
Uugh! Dysentery just doesn't seem to go away!

@irrelevant keep going!  Enjoying your trek to 5,000.

Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 04, 2014, 08:02:35 PM
@solarscreen  that's nice, thanks! Glad you are watching.

The stupid job assignment issue is starting in. Got farmers living half a map away from their fields.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 04, 2014, 08:16:06 PM
awwww welcome to my world @irrelevant   :-\
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 04, 2014, 08:39:11 PM
@RedKetchup It's really a perverse thing. I saw it happening in early spring, so I bailed out and reloaded a very recent save. Late winter. I fired all my farmers, and then re-hired them. I checked 20-30 fields with the pathing tool and it all looked good. The when it turned early spring I checked the same fields again, and they had been re-assigned; all over the map. Why!?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 04, 2014, 09:00:45 PM
i dunno :( thats sad. so it stats to happend around 2500 pop ?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 03:53:35 AM
Somewhere between 2200-2500
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 05:44:21 PM
Summer 53 - pop 2575

Screen 1 - this is always interesting, expanding farms around a hill, into a valley, with a forest node in the way. No more rows of houses-n-barns.

Screen 2 - the problem with squash, it grows so. slow. Look, the beanfield there is halfway harvested.

@RedKetchup you know, instead of making all crops the same, maybe the existing ones could just be tweaked a bit instead. Squash would be great if it just grew a little faster, maybe 75 days instead of 90. ;)

Screen 3 - here's a couple more, with another bean field.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 05, 2014, 06:03:03 PM
1045 families for 704 homes.... doesnt worrying you for the future ?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 06:04:13 PM
Not really, I'm always building houses. This happens to me every game. It slows me down a bit, and then there's another batch of nomads.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 06:06:40 PM
Screen 1 - Newport is 95% complete

@RedKetchup did you read the stuff I wrote just above about squash? I added it in an edit.

Screen 2 - still haven't quite decided what I'm going to do here with these forest tatas nodes. Industrial markets I guess, with houses. Not much space there for farms.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 05, 2014, 06:10:09 PM
yeah i saw /wink

i saw you are starting to appreciate my idea to put all crop a bit closer, at least fix some ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 06:11:26 PM
Yes! Not all alike, the differences are good, they just all need to work, is all.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 05, 2014, 06:13:07 PM
it s about same also i tried to do with milk and cows. only , and only use mutton/sheep is sad. i hope to make cow more valuable again ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 06:14:50 PM
yes, I think the milk mod is good, otherwise there's hardly any reason to raise cattle. this gives them a dimension that sheep, valuable as they are, do not have

chickens could be tweaked too, to bump the eggs up some. then they'd be worthwhile too
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 06:26:46 PM
This is why the squash do so poorly, they start harvesting in early autumn, before they have had a chance to reach max yield.

There must be something that says either "harvest when it's early autumn" or else " harvest when the temp falls below X"

Squash just needs to grow faster
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 06:44:10 PM
Stockpile porn.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 07:00:30 PM
And this is what you end up with.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 05, 2014, 07:19:45 PM
yeah thats sad, it need to be fixed
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 07:33:56 PM
Screen 1 - The first urbanization project, 15 houses out of two farms. There will be many. That's the original hostel there, by the way.

Screen 2 - Doing anything on the fringes of the map is always a challenge.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 08:33:24 PM
Okay, this evening I read someplace that it's the extra builders that cause this problem, looking for something to build. I don' t know, It seems reasonable, builders also are scattered all across the map. I'll try anything at this point. So I fired all my excess builders. We'll see.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 08:54:15 PM
Hm. Well, this year's better so far. Right here it is anyway.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 05, 2014, 09:18:35 PM
you ARE ... an Artist !! @irrelevant , really !
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 05, 2014, 09:25:30 PM
Wow @RedKetchup thanks very much. That's high praise coming from you!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 06, 2014, 01:41:39 AM
Quote
you ARE ... an Artist !! @irrelevant , really !

agree

Quote
Okay, this evening I read someplace that it's the extra builders that cause this problem, looking for something to build. I don' t know, It seems reasonable, builders also are scattered all across the map. I'll try anything at this point. So I fired all my excess builders. We'll see.

Might be something. Have you noticed any difference? And what about all extra workers, looking for something to carry.....? .....hm.....
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 06, 2014, 02:01:47 PM
Quote
you ARE ... an Artist !! @irrelevant , really !

agree

Quote
Okay, this evening I read someplace that it's the extra builders that cause this problem, looking for something to build. I don' t know, It seems reasonable, builders also are scattered all across the map. I'll try anything at this point. So I fired all my excess builders. We'll see.

Might be something. Have you noticed any difference? And what about all extra workers, looking for something to carry.....? .....hm.....

Thanks, Nilla.

I have noticed a difference, although who knows what is the reason. Farms are working well again, mainly full harvests, even among the squash.

Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 06, 2014, 07:39:47 PM
Winter 56 - pop 2833

Due for a couple of hundred nomads   :D

A quick tour up the east side, from south to north:

Screen 1 - Eastport Annex.

Screen 2 - Eastport Town

Screen 3 - Eastport merges with Crossriver/Oldtown

Screen 4 - Expanded Crossriver farm markets

Screen 5 - Additional Crossriver farm markets



Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 06, 2014, 07:48:31 PM
Screen 1 - Boot Hill Market will provide housing for needed additional Newport Longshoremen.

Screen 2 - The land occupied by these two forest nodes (which have been excellent producers for many years) will be better used as industrial markets and labor housing.

Screen 3 - This one too. That TP on that creek still cracks me up.

Screen 4 - And this one (that's a landlocked TP there, built to drag construction mats; it's got 500 logs inside). They're all being replaced by markets and farms and stuff.

Screen 5 - Welcome!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 06, 2014, 10:18:49 PM
Late Spring 57 - pop 3085
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 06, 2014, 10:53:42 PM
Last year 70 taverns produced 32,469 ale, average per tavern 463.8  8)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 07, 2014, 04:10:06 AM
463 Ale is excellent on a big map with that amount of people. I have looked a little bit before on my big trading villages and I have made some notes; On my small map  ~2500 Bannies I had 487 about the time, as i stopped to play, but on the medium map with ~4000 it was only 340-360. :( On the small map it was easy to find brewers who produced 600 ale or more but on the medium I was happy to find a few with 500.

I am sure you are building a bit wiser, you have much more markets and less ale producers on each market (OK I had to build tighter on that smaller map but I think I made too few)

I saw on the last picture that there is a church and a graveyard, do you have churches and graveyards for all people?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 07, 2014, 07:19:43 AM
@Nilla I think I may put markets closer together than most people do; I put them where I think they best support the logistics net, and if the circles overlap, they overlap. I also probably use more vendors. The markets in the industrial areas have 12-15, and I'll bump them to the max when I get enough housing. To me, that seems to be the best way to insure an efficient distribution system. Gotta make sure there's always fruit available everywhere!

I've been thinking that it doesn't really matter how far away from work vendors and traders live, unlike farmers and resource producers; they're going to be wandering around all the time in any case.

Making fair amounts of coats and tools too, 4877 tools (mix of steel for use and iron for trade) at 45 smiths (avg 108), and 4371 coats (mix of warm for use and wool for trade) at 39 tailors (avg 112).

For now I do have cemetery space for everyone; this may be about to change however. I do not have enough churches for all, never have had in this town.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 07, 2014, 08:18:43 AM
Time to get serious about building houses; going to need 150-200 new ones over the next couple of years. Got 27 under construction right now plus another 50 or so laid out, plus a couple of farm grids and 3-4 markets to finish laying out. Turning fields into farms is taking place here and there as well. Can get 6 houses on one 8x15.

Then it's on to the southwest corner; more farms.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 07, 2014, 09:00:13 PM
Early Winter 57 - pop 3127

Most time spent in game today was paused, laying out farms and markets. But all nomads are now in houses, all children are in school.

Screen 1 - Newport expansion, housing for vendors and traders.

Screen 2 - the landlocked trader at last comes into play, the nexus for expansion into the southwest corner.

Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 09, 2014, 08:15:28 PM
Late Summer 59 - pop 3225

Screen 1 - Squash is beginning to grow on me.  ;) Give it the full complement of farmers, and hit the fields with the priority tool in early spring, and it does okay. Laughs at early frost while beans dissolve. Keeps growing down to 28F
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 09, 2014, 09:12:04 PM
Late Autumn 59 - pop 3251, 65% of the way there.

Screen 1 - Merchies bringin' it.

Screen 2 - Southwest corner is going to be tough, even with the boost provided by construction mats dragged to (and bought at!) the landlocked TP.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: canis39 on September 10, 2014, 04:52:37 PM
I think it's a sign that you have a little bit of an obsession with trading posts when you refer to merchants as "merchies".   ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 10, 2014, 05:33:02 PM
@canis39  LOL, nah, that goes back to my days of playing a game called "War in the Pacific", on computer in the 00s, and with paper maps and cardboard counters in the 80s and 90s. Merchant ships figured heavily in both versions, and players called them "merchies" for short. I'll forever call merchant vessels that.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 10, 2014, 06:33:56 PM
Winter 59 pop 3241, paused almost all evening. Pop is going the wrong way! I expected this, I was slow with building houses a few years back. I may even lose a hundred or two before it starts to trend back up. Couples moving into new houses now are in their 30s, they probably will have only one child, two at the most. Fortunately I have plenty of space to build houses.

Screen 1 - the last big farm area laid out. This will be challenging, down in the corner. I do have the landlocked TP, and another one is being built there on the right.

Screen 2 - this is disturbing, these houses just are sitting here empty. I never have seen this before. :o

Screen 3 - okay, that's better. I just witnessed something interesting; these houses sat there empty until someone died, then they instantly were occupied. And with couples young enough to have three children. :D

Screen 4 - Notice there's no one on that bridge? Everyone crosses there on the bottom of the lake. You can just make them out down there.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 10, 2014, 06:47:19 PM
you are losing your momentum ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 10, 2014, 06:50:46 PM
Temporarily, mon frere, temporarily. ;) Did you see my edit?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 10, 2014, 07:09:08 PM
yeah. and btw about the bridge, i think it s a bug happening when the bridge is next to a trading post. and if you place it couple of 1x1 away , further, it doesnt happends.

and yeah at least the female are younger :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 10, 2014, 07:22:58 PM
Farms - edit: someone on Reddit who saw this screenshot told me that I needed more barns. He also said that with pop 3250 I should have 2,000,000 food in the bank. Troll.

Screen 2 - when you are trying to expand into a remote area on a big map with high pop, it can be a challenge. The builders can come from anywhere, and may spend all their time commuting. Notice that none of my new farms in this are working. This is a decision I have made, to use the farmers' housing for builders. Nearly all of the houses in this screen have two builders living in them. I am going to continue this policy forward to see how it works down here.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 10, 2014, 07:37:22 PM
hahaha , looks great !
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 10, 2014, 08:10:37 PM
@RedKetchup Got 342 nomads. Would you take them if you were me, with my housing situation? Got tools, got coats. Food is so-so, but I can always buy more.

I don't need them obviously, but I'd like to have them. But I'm not sure. You have more experience with nomads than I do, LOL  ;D

Edit: I decided not to take them. My housing that's under construction is concentrated in just a couple of spots. I don't want to have whole suburbs of uneducated workers. If they were going to be spread out, that would be different.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 11, 2014, 04:10:34 AM
I am sure you did the right thing.

Not only because of the education, I am quite sure, in that situation; as you have so many more families than houses, the nomads bring no real population growth! They move into the houses, where otherwise your educated young adults would have moved into => They must wait longer and when they move out they will have less children.

You can see this very clear in the graph.

I took the nomads; the population growth (tangent of the graph) fell for a while. If I hadnīt taken the nomads, the population would have bin the same after a few year (orange line). The difference - better educated.

I only take nomads if i am prepared for them (free houses or none of my original population will move into the ones I will start to build) or if I need workforce or just fast a big population.

Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 11, 2014, 04:21:44 AM
hehe sorry , i didnt got time to see your post. i was totally 100% into making a bugfix for my creamery :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 11, 2014, 04:41:48 AM
I am sure you did the right thing.

Not only because of the education, I am quite sure, in that situation; as you have so many more families than houses, the nomads bring no real population growth! They move into the houses, where otherwise your educated young adults would have moved into => They must wait longer and when they move out they will have less children.

You can see this very clear in the graph.

I took the nomads; the population growth (tangent of the graph) fell for a while. If I hadnīt taken the nomads, the population would have bin the same after a few year (orange line). The difference - better educated.

I only take nomads if i am prepared for them (free houses or none of my original population will move into the ones I will start to build) or if I need workforce or just fast a big population.

@Nilla Thanks for sharing that, that's very interesting. I would not have thought of that, but it makes sense. I definitely will remember that.
@RedKetchup NP, I know you've got a plateful just now. :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 14, 2014, 04:25:50 PM
Early Winter 62 - pop 3396

Entering the final push, have laid out most of the rest of the map, and starting to convert farms to housing.

In the past 5 years I've built 216 stone houses (20% of my total) and have 24 more under construction, with maybe 60 more laid out.

Screen 1 - the far southwest corner is coming along slowly. Builders commuting from BFE really slows things down. The houses there have lots of builders in them, but they don't seem to be working locally. Maybe I should just cease any and all construction except for down here.

Screen 2 - South Central (it's upside-down, couldn't get it all in the frame otherwise)

Screen 3 & 4 - the last remaining unplanned bits.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 14, 2014, 04:50:59 PM
hehe not alot of space left :)
after , just let the houses fill with 3 children each :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 14, 2014, 05:02:42 PM
That's the plan!  :D Oh, plus that batch of 900 nomads to put me over the top  ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 14, 2014, 05:18:23 PM
mwahahaha good luck ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 14, 2014, 06:08:49 PM
Standard 15x8 farm urbanization

Modified 12x10 farm urbanization (barn replacing 2 houses)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 14, 2014, 08:49:54 PM
Screen 1 - South Central progress

Screen 2 - Southwest progress, slow. as. molasses.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 14, 2014, 08:59:10 PM
"Oh dear, Rosevelyn has Yellow Fever; do you think we should go inside the hospital to idle, or just stand out here within range?"

Idiots  >:(
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 14, 2014, 09:11:58 PM
but... but... but.... Rosevelyn she our good friend ! we cant let her there like that ! we care !
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 14, 2014, 09:15:16 PM
As soon as I'm done with this town, I'm going to start using @RedKetchup Fences™  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: rkelly17 on September 15, 2014, 10:04:43 AM
"Oh dear, Rosevelyn has Yellow Fever; do you think we should go inside the hospital to idle, or just stand out here within range?"

Idiots  >:(

Exactly.

But remember, there is hope for ending the insanity: @RedKetchup's hospital mod.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 15, 2014, 11:25:40 AM
Yeah @rkelly17 , but you don't have to go inside the hospital to catch whatever contagion those inside are infected with. Seems like no matter where you put your roads, the wheelbarrow battalion will find a shortcut that takes them right past the hospital, even though they have to walk round on a mountain side. That's what the fences are for!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: rkelly17 on September 16, 2014, 05:34:36 AM
Yeah @rkelly17 , but you don't have to go inside the hospital to catch whatever contagion those inside are infected with. Seems like no matter where you put your roads, the wheelbarrow battalion will find a shortcut that takes them right past the hospital, even though they have to walk round on a mountain side. That's what the fences are for!

Too, too true. It is so hard to find a spot for a hospital that is off of all traffic routes. I'm doing a town right noe with a "flat land" map which only has mountains around the edge of the map. You'll never guess where I'm putting all the hospitals.  ;D

I started this before @RedKetchup did the "remove happiness from the hospital" mod, so the little devils still go all the way out to the edge of the map to idle at or in the hospital.  >:( I just had a mumps outbreak where patient 0 got to a remote hospital without infecting anyone. Almost immediately 4 more people got the mumps in and around the hospital.  >:(  >:(
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 16, 2014, 07:57:50 AM
@rkelly17 Yes, that has happened to me over and over. Get patient 0 to the hospital without anyone else being infected, and then the idlers become ill. >:(

Placement of hospitals has become something that I feel like I must put way too much thought into.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 16, 2014, 12:54:04 PM
I have started to put hospitals behind pastures, seems to keep the idlers from going there and still the sick ones can go through the pasture. Since I do this, I havnīt have one serious outbreak of any decease. (maybe a coincidence but maybe not).
Although......
it is a wonder that the sick people are healed at that noise from chicken and sheep!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 16, 2014, 12:54:42 PM
we call that : Zootherapy :P
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: rkelly17 on September 16, 2014, 02:44:46 PM
To show you how crazy this makes me, check out http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=467.0
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 16, 2014, 03:24:27 PM
heheeh ah children !!

if it happends to finally use the bobbi doctor house.... remember you ll need to remove your old hospital and rebuild it ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 16, 2014, 05:28:01 PM
Not much idling at hospitals behind pastures (unless you are a cow (the lady with the violet skirt is the doctor getting outside for a short smoke or something)

The pasture-model is not absolutely fool-proof, I saw a child idling outside, and than going into the hospital as people were sick! Probably visiting mum in the hospital ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 17, 2014, 06:00:57 AM
Late Spring 66 - pop 3667

Houses finally caught up with families. Really painful building anything now. Builders have horrible long commutes. Trying to decide whether to go through the frustration of attempting to develop this last bit of wilderness.

Had to turn down my video settings to low, otherwise the lag was unbearable.

Somehow going to have to build another 100-200 houses to get to 5000 though.

Gonna be wooden houses from here on out. Got plenty of stone, but it takes considerably less labor for wooden. No lack of firewood anyway.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 18, 2014, 04:45:39 PM
Autumn 67 - pop 3822

776,000 food! never had that much, ever. Buying every apple and pecan that comes my way, I'm sure I'll need them.

When my most recent batch of farms (45 of them, pretty much all at once) came online, I was very concerned because many of the farmers were coming in from far away, despite the fact that I had started them working and assigned the farmers in early winter the previous year. That first harvest was pretty bad, such that if it had continued that way I'd be lucky to reach 4000, let alone 5000. But the next year the farmers sorted themselves out, and this year they all pretty much are living quite near their fields.

The builders, now, are another matter. When you assign a builder it seems pretty clear that you get whatever laborer is next in the queue, regardless of where he is at the time, or of where he lives. And builders, it seems, never get reassigned unless you stop the projects and fire all the builders; then start them all back up again, and get another random crew that may or may not be any better. I have tried many different ways to try to work around this, all to no avail.

Which is why I'm very excited about my new undertaking, to build a market, a few farms, and some houses and barns on this final frontier plot here. /s  ::) No producers this time (well, a chopper, I suppose), just a market, storage, farms, and homes. Pretty sure I'm going to need whatever farm production I can get here, at least a dozen farms closer to the river will need to be urbanized.

Screen 2 - But the next year the farmers sorted themselves out, and this year they all pretty much are living quite near their fields. Hm, well, when the frost hits it's easy enough to see where this is not the case. There are maybe a dozen fields like this (in other words, 3% 4%); it's odd, these are well-established fields, 10-20 years old. Beats me. If I figure anything out, I'll update.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 18, 2014, 05:48:02 PM
Screen 1 thru 3 - Now, laborers? I got no problem with laborers. :D

Screen 4 - Late Winter - Pause everything, to make sure any farmers have a chance to go home and stock their pantries before planting.

Actually, I'm pleasantly surprised at the number of 120s I've got here. Eleven 120s, and some oddballs. By the time I build a market and a couple rows of houses'n'barns I'll have 8-10 120-tile farms here.

Screen 5 - First two traders of the new year, boatloads like this make me happy.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 18, 2014, 06:24:09 PM
still need 1 more "k" citizens :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 18, 2014, 06:50:35 PM
Indeed I do.  ;D I'll make it, maybe even while it's still September, but probably not while it's still summer.

I really can't comprehend how you did that so quickly. You are a machine. I hate to think how many hours I have in this town.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 18, 2014, 07:58:11 PM
Holy smokes. My eyes are bleeding after seeing how many blacksmiths, tailors and brewers you have  :o

Interesting about the farmers though. Weird that they glitch out like that. On builders, I've noticed that on these newer builds, they tend to move house very quickly when there are jobs to do, or rather I guess, whoever is closest are changed to builders, probably to reduce the chance of the walking death that occurred before. This then means that farmers can get moved farther away from the fields, I've seen this happen a few times in my save, but that can't be the case with that guy I would think.

With such sizes though... perhaps there is a limit in the game to how many re-shuffles it can do simultaneously, to reduce lag? If farmers happen to be far down on that list, that may be one explanation.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 18, 2014, 08:05:16 PM
Holy smokes. My eyes are bleeding after seeing how many blacksmiths, tailors and brewers you have  :o

Basically a tailor and a blacksmith on every market, plus a few extras near markets/stockpiles close to the traders. Brewers you can put two on most markets, and 4-6 on the ones close to the TPs (assuming you are buying fruit). You do need to invest heavily in vendors if you do this (and therefore, in housing near the markets).

Interesting about the farmers though. Weird that they glitch out like that.

I think that the farmers just are not re-assigned as frequently as the other professions are. This causes some problems when you have many farms and are creating many more.

On builders, I've noticed that on these newer builds, they tend to move house very quickly when there are jobs to do, or rather I guess, whoever is closest are changed to builders, probably to reduce the chance of the walking death that occurred before. This then means that farmers can get moved farther away from the fields, I've seen this happen a few times in my save, but that can't be the case with that guy I would think.

With such sizes though... perhaps there is a limit in the game to how many re-shuffles it can do simultaneously, to reduce lag? If farmers happen to be far down on that list, that may be one explanation.


Builders are a mystery to me. They do very well, up to a point; after that point (whatever it may be) they are wretched. I think it is a combination of the size of the map, how much pop there is, how many laborers, how many projects, how near the projects are to the edge of the map. As these factors become less favorable, construction times increase dramatically, as most of the builders' time is spent commuting.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 18, 2014, 08:11:34 PM
Fair point on the builders, it could well be that this village is simply too big with too many people for the game to handle very well.

On markets, though, do you have loads of them, with overlapping circles?

It's good to see these numbers, as we small-time builders can see where the benchmark is :D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 18, 2014, 08:33:59 PM
Markets are like the circulatory system that keeps the lifeblood flowing to the muscles and organs. Just don't skimp on vendors. Most of these near the river have 18-24. The ones further out have fewer, 9-12, a few with six.

Trading posts are similar, if you rely on importing say, logs, fruit, nuts, iron, and wool, as I am here. Most of my TPs are maxxed out at 20 traders each.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 18, 2014, 11:28:55 PM
Thanks for posting those pictures, very interesting. In the first few pictures, everything looks setup to supply the Trading OPs (:D), but you appear to have similar overlap between all markets. I've rather had them slightly touching, more similar to how I set up neighbouring foresters for instance. Guess that's not efficient enough. I have a lot to learn :p

Btw, doesn't the game lag horribly with such population numbers on a large map? Do you play with all graphics settings off? Admittedly I'm using everything on full tilt now, but I'm already noticing slight lags from time to time - and that is with a new computer.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 19, 2014, 02:44:21 AM
Thanks for posting those pictures, very interesting. In the first few pictures, everything looks setup to supply the Trading OPs (:D), but you appear to have similar overlap between all markets. I've rather had them slightly touching, more similar to how I set up neighbouring foresters for instance. Guess that's not efficient enough. I have a lot to learn :p
It's just one way to do it, I'm not saying it's the right way; it certainly is not the only way. But having the markets this close together is what allows me to have so many breweries though, and to have them producing at this level (87 produce ~40,000 ale last year, 459 average), it's the best way to insure that if there is fruit around at all, there will be some in this particular spot, at the market. And believe me, there is plenty of fruit  ;)

Ale is the only way I can have enough food for this kind of pop, gotta buy so much food.

"Trading OPs" that's good. ;D

Btw, doesn't the game lag horribly with such population numbers on a large map? Do you play with all graphics settings off? Admittedly I'm using everything on full tilt now, but I'm already noticing slight lags from time to time - and that is with a new computer.
Yes, it's pretty slow, especially when the merchants are arriving (mine all come at the same time). Yes, the graphics are turned down as low as I can figure out how to set them. If I could turn them down more I would, but I know very little about tweaking hardware settings.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 19, 2014, 04:16:21 AM
I have a small question;

Have you noticed any difference of how slow the game is in spring/autumn compared to winter?

The background to my question:

In my last game, as I tested the milk and honey in a bit larger scale, I had a bit fragile supply and once, with about 2500 people I had no tools. At the most I think about 400 was tool-less at some time. The game became so slow that if the "armada" of tradesmen hadnīt bin saving me, I would have given it up. Before and after these problems , the game was a bit slower, but still good playable (medium map). I have noticed this before. Seems that it takes a lot of computing power to look for tools. I think we have also noticed, that if we have too many free builders, looking for building commissions; the game gets slower. But what is about laborers, looking for something to carry? In winter, when there is no farming to do, the farmers all act as laborers. In my biggest game (the 4k on a medium map) I didnīt have much farming left, to notice anything, but you got a lot of farmers unemployed in winter.

So, back to my question, do these unemployed farmers together with the normal amount of laborers, all looking for work, make the game slower?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 19, 2014, 04:39:02 AM
@Nilla I have not really noticed any difference in seasons up to now, but in my case the lag is so much worse when my merchants are on the map (I have herded them into a pack, all arriving and leaving within the space of a month or maybe two), when I do finally do turn them all loose from the TPs, the difference is such a relief!

But now that you mention it, I'll pay more attention to winter lag vs the rest of the year. Even then it may be difficult to figure out, as they currently are arriving in late winter and leaving sometime in the spring.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 19, 2014, 04:55:15 PM
"Llewellin the builder fell off a ladder and died."

Good! Idling bastard deserved it. ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 19, 2014, 04:56:12 PM
Do you usually build enough chapels and graveyards on these maps, and if not, is there any real downside to not doing so? Will the people get noticeably less happy due to deaths for example, or will ale and such make up for this?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 19, 2014, 05:03:13 PM
This is the first town in which I have not done so. Overall happiness has not suffered much, four and a half stars where I've always had five. I haven't checked individual happiness cause there are just too many guys. I've never had enough chapels; I've run out of cemetery space a couple of times, and I'm about to do so again, this time for good. In any case there is nothing to do about it, I'm out of space to spend on that stuff. I have no idea whether all the taverns have helped. Happiness is another black box.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 19, 2014, 05:35:52 PM
Found one. Of course it's my critical path builder. Not sure why she's so unhappy. Maybe the pressure of her high-visibility job has made her crack. Her husband and son are both 5 stars. Maybe they're just jerks.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 19, 2014, 05:56:13 PM
She has probably lost somebody then, a parent or sibling, with no grave to go to. At those sizes though, it must be nigh on impossible to keep up with chapels and gravestones. Must be maybe a thousand people in the ground at any one moment, and that  takes space which can be better used for farms or industry. As long as the overall happiness is still good, it's probably not all that important.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 19, 2014, 06:31:53 PM
Only six farms. More houses than I'd expected though. And that's what really matters, closing in on 4000.

Wooden houses was a good choice.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 19, 2014, 07:30:54 PM
Early Winter 68 - Pop 4000!

Education is nearly maxxed; must be time for more nomads. ;D

Those farms wont be placed in service in 69, not until 70.

Screen 2 - major urbanization project
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 19, 2014, 08:52:40 PM
Up to now, I haven't been aggressive enough about building houses. No more. Population stability and sustainability is not a major concern at this point. I could finish this probably in three or four years of growth like this plus a big wad of nomads at just the right moment to push me over the top, a la @RedKetchup  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 19, 2014, 09:22:31 PM
wooot go go go :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 20, 2014, 02:16:53 AM
I see on one picture you have built wooden houses, but I see a lot of stone houses as well.

I have read your blog from the start and my opinion is, you do nothing without a thoroughly considered reason. What is the reason for this?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 20, 2014, 07:08:05 AM
@Nilla The first twenty or thirty houses I built in this town were wooden, I upgraded some but others still are dotted around here and there. I didn't have enough stone for stone houses then, and I wanted to push the pop early by giving every couple a house ASAP.

The houses I am building now also are wooden, I have made this decision in a effort to work around the issues I am having with builders. Wooden houses require 30 labor units, stone houses require 45 labor units. That's the reason.

I figure I'll be done with this town in just a few years, so there is no real reason to build quality, thinking of the future. I have plenty of firewood, the only thing I want now is for the population to grow.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 20, 2014, 09:02:16 AM
Late Spring 70 - pop 4265

I was afraid this would happen. Too few, too soon.  :( >:( Very disappointing. :-\

They've been coming every 5 years or so. Didn't really want to go that much longer (and it could be 7, 8, who knows how many years). But I'm determined to top @RedKetchup in nomads, even if it's just for one day, like last time  ;D I'll never have another better chance than this town; never going for pop like this again, it's too painful.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 20, 2014, 10:44:34 AM
@Nilla Am I insane for continuing to make coats and tools? Including what I have in TPs, I've got 20,600 iron tools, 5400 steel tools, 26,500 wool coats and 3700 warm coats.

I use the iron tools to buy steel tools and iron. I use the wool coats to buy warm coats and wool.

Occasionally I use them to buy food, when there isn't sufficient ale in a TP to buy all that the food merchant has brought.

I expect to finally put this town aside in 8 years, possibly less.

Anyone?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 20, 2014, 05:41:10 PM
Late Winter 70 - pop 4405

Converting sheep into mutton, pastures into housing tracts. This one needed a market.

This will be the final housing project I think, gradually changing all these pastures into wooden houses until I reach 5000.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 20, 2014, 07:48:03 PM
i remember that last 1000 pop was extremly painful ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 20, 2014, 08:01:51 PM
It's the damn merchants! The game slows to a crawl when they are on the map. And then there's the trading.... ::)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 20, 2014, 08:05:01 PM
it s 1 to 2 hrs of play for 1 year of game ^^

it s when you get that pop you learn that the game is meant to be played at 1x ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 20, 2014, 08:34:09 PM
it s 1 to 2 hrs of play for 1 year of game ^^

it s when you get that pop you learn that the game is meant to be played at 1x ^^
I can do 2x, but yeah, an hour or two. I want that big batch of nomads!  But what I'd have to go through to get them :P
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 20, 2014, 08:46:58 PM
Late Summer 71 - Now there's something I never had happen, ran out of classroom space. Forty-three schools wasn't enough. Children now are entering the workforce as uneducated laborers at age ten.

I just ran out of places to put schools. Guess I should have built more of them as I was expanding. At the time it seemed like I was building crazy amounts of schools. But I didn't consider that I would have to come back through and urbanize agricultural areas. Local pop got way more dense and the schools filled up.

Also have some 25-year-old female students, married, living in houses. But they won't have children til they graduate. That's another sign I wasn't building enough schools, long student commutes.

Wow, I blew through 4500 pop and didn't even notice! That happened fast.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 20, 2014, 09:59:53 PM
Also have some 25-year-old female students, married, living in houses. But they won't have children til they graduate. That's another sign I wasn't building enough schools, long student commutes.

Wow, I blew through 4500 pop and didn't even notice! That happened fast.

Interesting! Is long commuting to their school the reason people can stay in school for so long? I thought it was random.

Well done and congratulations with 4500 :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 20, 2014, 10:18:37 PM
haha school things happended to me like 3 times ^^
grats on 4500 :)

of course your town will be more healthy than mine, i didnt passed like 2 months on it ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 21, 2014, 02:34:00 AM
@Nilla Am I insane for continuing to make coats and tools? Including what I have in TPs, I've got 20,600 iron tools, 5400 steel tools, 26,500 wool coats and 3700 warm coats.

I use the iron tools to buy steel tools and iron. I use the wool coats to buy warm coats and wool.

Occasionally I use them to buy food, when there isn't sufficient ale in a TP to buy all that the food merchant has brought.

I expect to finally put this town aside in 8 years, possibly less.

Anyone?

You are all but insane.

If you build a trading economy on tools, clothing and ale on a small and even a medium map (but there I am not so sure) or if you have a goal to make 2000 peps, yes than I think it isnīt the most efficient way. But with the logistics on a big map, going for the 5000 I think it is wise to have more than "two legs".
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 21, 2014, 07:15:18 AM
Thanks for your input @Nilla. Also, since we spoke of it some days ago, I wanted to update coat and tool production numbers. Last year produced 7226 tools at 55 smiths avg ~131, 7046 coats @53 tailors avg ~133. Why the average has improved so much over a few years back, I cannot say.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 21, 2014, 07:19:50 AM
haha school things happended to me like 3 times ^^
grats on 4500 :)

of course your town will be more healthy than mine, i didnt passed like 2 months on it ^^

Thanks Red

Six weeks ;) Yes I still can't comprehend how you built that town in just 9 days. Do you even sleep?  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 21, 2014, 07:23:29 AM

Interesting! Is long commuting to their school the reason people can stay in school for so long? I thought it was random.

Well done and congratulations with 4500 :)

@Pangaea Thanks!

No, if a student attends a school directly next to where she lives, she can graduate when she turns 16. So, education takes 5 years of school, and to that you add how much time is spent walking back and forth. Normally it isn't so much but in a town like this it can be.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 21, 2014, 08:02:05 AM

Thanks Red

Six weeks ;) Yes I still can't comprehend how you built that town in just 9 days. Do you even sleep?  ;D

i had to hurry lol
imagine, i would still be there and not MOD'ing p ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 21, 2014, 09:15:38 AM

Interesting! Is long commuting to their school the reason people can stay in school for so long? I thought it was random.

Well done and congratulations with 4500 :)

@Pangaea Thanks!

No, if a student attends a school directly next to where she lives, she can graduate when she turns 16. So, education takes 5 years of school, and to that you add how much time is spent walking back and forth. Normally it isn't so much but in a town like this it can be.

Good to know! Could be a big mistake to put up loads of schools, just to make up the numbers, in a remote location then. I happened to put up a cluster of schools in my main savegame, but thankfully it happened to be close to the main population centre, so it should probably work out okay.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 21, 2014, 09:53:42 AM
I tried to put one near every market (I normally lay out a market together with all surrounding buildings, farms, and roads at the same time), and then add a few more wherever I could fit one in. Turned out not to be enough here. And the fact that graduations were delayed due to long commutes, has also led to the fact that I don't have enough classroom space. If students were all graduating before age 20, the schools would be 1/3 empty.

Like so many other systems in this game, once the school system becomes stressed, it can easily spiral out of control.

I can easily imagine that this started out as a local problem, school(s) in one area filled up, students from that area started filling up schools in surrounding areas, pushing students in those areas further out, etc.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: rkelly17 on September 21, 2014, 10:00:27 AM
Good to know! Could be a big mistake to put up loads of schools, just to make up the numbers, in a remote location then. I happened to put up a cluster of schools in my main savegame, but thankfully it happened to be close to the main population centre, so it should probably work out okay.

I always spread schools around the map--one near every market square--since I had one poor fellow still in school at 23 because he lived so far from the school. I used to build a new school just before the old ones maxed out. Now I build them profligately even if only half the slots are filled.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 21, 2014, 10:17:52 AM
Good to know! Could be a big mistake to put up loads of schools, just to make up the numbers, in a remote location then. I happened to put up a cluster of schools in my main savegame, but thankfully it happened to be close to the main population centre, so it should probably work out okay.

I always spread schools around the map--one near every market square--since I had one poor fellow still in school at 23 because he lived so far from the school. I used to build a new school just before the old ones maxed out. Now I build them profligately even if only half the slots are filled.
In my case here, building a new school "just in time" is just not possible. Not only are children turning 10yo at a furious pace, it also takes months to build a new school given the issue with builders.

But 99% of the time, "just in time" is fine. As long as you keep an eye on your school cap. Too bad there isn't an alert for this, like production limits.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: rkelly17 on September 21, 2014, 10:20:51 AM
But 99% of the time, "just in time" is fine. As long as you keep an eye on your school cap. Too bad there isn't an alert for this, like production limits.

True enough. I'm just trying to get everybody through school as quickly as possible.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 21, 2014, 11:51:24 AM
I am not sure of this, but as far as I have checked it out the students stay in the school they started, until they have spent the necessary time in the classroom and are considered adults. They donīt change schools so as the adults changes their workplaces. (or maybe they do but it takes a longer time than I have looked): After I noticed this I always build many schools all over the map, generally long before I need them. But I understand with 4.5 k it is really hard.

 I cross my fingers for those 600 nomads you are waiting for!!!!!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 21, 2014, 01:42:47 PM
I am not sure of this, but as far as I have checked it out the students stay in the school they started, until they have spent the necessary time in the classroom and are considered adults. They donīt change schools so as the adults changes their workplaces. (or maybe they do but it takes a longer time than I have looked): After I noticed this I always build many schools all over the map, generally long before I need them. But I understand with 4.5 k it is really hard.

 I cross my fingers for those 600 nomads you are waiting for!!!!!
Thanks @Nilla. I finally got some more schools built; now the number of students has dropped significantly. Oh well, crisis passed anyway.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 21, 2014, 03:47:55 PM
Late Spring 73 - pop 4851

Now that essentially nothing is happening, except for 3-4 houses at a time being built, the lag has become almost bearable. Sometimes even running at 10x :o But the merchants will be here soon, and it will be back to a crawl.

All those wooden houses there, and the market and the 7 schools, all were carved out of the sheep pastures that have been there since the early years of this town. Makes me a little nostalgic for the old days  :'( :D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 21, 2014, 07:25:09 PM
Early Winter 73 - pop 5000!

Going to keep going though, because you know what? I want those nomads, and even if I get 900 of them, I think this town can take them, for a year anyway. ;) And now that I only have 6 builders working, nothing else going on, the lag isn't bad, running on 5x and even 10x sometimes.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 21, 2014, 08:03:16 PM
A BIG CONGRATULATION ! My Friend !

you did it !!!!!!!
you took your time but your city can take 1-2 more k :)
you are THE Master :)

Grats my friend !
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 22, 2014, 02:36:45 AM
Thanks, @RedKetchup ! That means a lot, coming from you.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 22, 2014, 02:49:16 AM
 :D   :D   :D

Congratulations!

You did it, didnīt doubt a second, you could make it. You build so beautifully (not only to look at, for me beauty is also function). and patiant, and a decent computer..... nothing can go wrong!!!"!!!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 22, 2014, 07:21:04 AM
:D   :D   :D

Congratulations!

You did it, didnīt doubt a second, you could make it. You build so beautifully (not only to look at, for me beauty is also function). and patiant, and a decent computer..... nothing can go wrong!!!"!!!

@Nilla thank you so much! And as far as "nothing can go wrong," here's knocking on wood! ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: rkelly17 on September 22, 2014, 09:35:27 AM
Congratulations, @irrelevant on achieving 5000, a number I can only dream of. Not only excellent work, but dogged persistence as well.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 22, 2014, 10:42:12 AM
Fantastic achievement and congratulations. 10,000 next? :D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 22, 2014, 10:51:13 AM
Congratulations, @irrelevant on achieving 5000, a number I can only dream of. Not only excellent work, but dogged persistence as well.
@rkelly17 Thanks very much! Lacking the amazing creativity that some of you here have, and lacking the brilliance of some others, dogged persistence is pretty much all I've got  ;)
Fantastic achievement and congratulations. 10,000 next? :D
@Pangaea Thank you! 10,000? Not in this life. ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 22, 2014, 12:09:04 PM
just need to post it in the challenge thread :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: salamander on September 22, 2014, 12:22:22 PM
With size of the largest size map, would it even be possible to make 10,000?  Just wondering.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 22, 2014, 12:31:32 PM
With size of the largest size map, would it even be possible to make 10,000?  Just wondering.

Think those are 784 vs 512 for large maps. If that represents squares in each direction, the huge map will actually be more than twice the size of large maps. About 614 000 vs 262 000. So in that case it should be possible. It's a big ask though, and the lag must be unbearable. There is also the flatten tool, or the total flatland maps, so there one could just farm the lot really.

e: It's actually 768, not 784, but still, over twice as large, provided it's ^2.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 22, 2014, 01:20:52 PM
just need to post it in the challenge thread :)
Ah! Right.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: rkelly17 on September 23, 2014, 10:37:30 AM
@rkelly17 Thanks very much! Lacking the amazing creativity that some of you here have, and lacking the brilliance of some others, dogged persistence is pretty much all I've got  ;)

One should understand one's strengths and go with them.  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 06:32:22 PM
Okay, here we go! One way or another, this is almost over! ;D

Summer 74 - accepted 661 nomads; perfect!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 23, 2014, 06:43:58 PM
sweet :) you 'll beat me :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 06:49:41 PM
Yes, well, it looks that way, but assuming that I do, you are still the Banished master. You have single-handedly made this game 100% better than it would have been. No one can beat that.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 06:50:47 PM
Also, now I may have to let this run and see if I can get 6k! 8)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 06:54:01 PM
This is fascinating; they swarmed into the nearby markets, grabbing up tools and coats.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 06:59:34 PM
Of course it would be smallpox; I foresee many sick bannies.

Screen 2 - Autumn 74 -  first smallpox death, 60 current cases. I knew I was skimping on hospitals, but I don't think any number of hospitals would have made a difference here. Too many bannies wandering around. At least the harvest hasn't been disrupted (so far); I expect it's the last one there will be for Sink Mill.

Students, children, teachers, and laborers (half of my town), there's nothing you can do.

Screen 3 - 10 deaths, 143 cases. I've shut down half my markets, TPs, and breweries. Not much else to do. I'd feel bad, except I know I only have to get through 9 more months. I have enough food, and that's all that matters.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 08:20:55 PM
Late Autumn 74 - pop 5787 - I think this is going to be as high as my pop gets  ;)

1005 cases, 31 deaths

2006 cases, 86 deaths

3028 cases, 186 deaths - you know what this feels like? Like when you were thirteen and you built that model plane that you put all those hours into, and it sat on your shelf for awhile, and then one day you were bored and tired of it, and you took it out into the vacant lot next door, and you and your buds shot it up with BB guns. ;D

Winter 74 - 2991 cases, 400 deaths

No more screenshots, it's all the same - 2814 cases, 500 deaths

2384 cases, 600 deaths

2194 cases, 700 deaths

Still Winter 74 - 2048 cases, 760 deaths; all the nomads are in houses now, though  :D

1255 cases, 900 deaths

822 cases, 984 deaths, pop now back under 5000

Early Spring 75 - 118 cases, 1100 deaths



Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 09:28:29 PM
Early Spring - 12 cases, 1112 deaths - planting has begun, merchants are waiting at TPs

Pop 4903  :o
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 23, 2014, 09:32:10 PM
so ... you lost double people than you ve got from the nomad pack.... pretty Deadly :S
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 09:39:12 PM
Yep. Smallpox is brutal. But it was certainly exciting! ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 09:46:17 PM
Spring 75 - 1 case, in hospital - pop 5000  8)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 09:56:51 PM
Crashed out  >:( Had to revert to a 25-minute-old auto save. ::)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 23, 2014, 10:42:26 PM
Late Summer 75 - pop 5167

Important safety tip - never, ever accept nomads into a crowded town.

Harvest has begun. Back to business as usual. This is a tough town; don't screw with Sink Mill.

I'd say this is the end for Sink Mill. It's been a fun ride.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 24, 2014, 12:40:03 AM
Could be a baby boom now, with presumably many fresh couples in new houses, so could still be possible to push to 6000.

Think I would have been mortified had that happened to me after putting in so many hours in one save. Thankfully it worked out okay in the end, despite all those deaths. How did you keep on top of that btw? They must have been dropping like flies.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: assobanana76 on September 24, 2014, 12:44:00 AM
I saw the thread now !!
oh god !! 5,000 people ??
I struggle to get to 100 !!  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Nilla on September 24, 2014, 03:36:20 AM
oh small pox, worse than yellow fever (I read that other thread first)

But anyhow: This is Banished.

This is also a thing I love about Banished: that such things might happen and that you could survive it and fight through it.

(to be true I really donīt like that fire-harmless-making- patch, much funnier at the beginning and from an historical point of view, it was much more correct. Here in Sweden all old towns I know of, had some major city-destruction-fires. Our town from the 16th century had 3)

And @irrelevant you are the master builder, not only the one of "dogged persistence". Your way of building - ought to be a raw-model for us all!!!!!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 24, 2014, 04:37:41 AM
How did you keep on top of that btw? They must have been dropping like flies.

I didn't; there was nothing to do, I just watched.

Yes, they were. Lots of bonging :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 24, 2014, 04:44:05 AM
@Nilla thank you, but I'm really not. I'm just a technician executing a plan. There are others on here who are real artists, one of those being you. And if everyone built like me, it would really be boring. Even I don't want to build like me, after these last three towns!  ;) I'm going to have to do something different (still Banished, though).
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: assobanana76 on September 24, 2014, 04:47:32 AM
@Nilla thank you, but I'm really not. I'm just a technician executing a plan. There are others on here who are real artists, one of those being you. And if everyone built like me, it would really be boring. Even I don't want to build like me, after these last three towns!  ;) I'm going to have to do something different (still Banished, though).
to do something different you should do a triple somersault and build a mountain community of 50 people !!  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on September 24, 2014, 08:42:37 AM
How did you keep on top of that btw? They must have been dropping like flies.

I didn't; there was nothing to do, I just watched.

Yes, they were. Lots of bonging :)

Oh sorry, I meant how did you manage to count how many died of smallpox? People would still be born so a case of population then - now wouldn't really do.

It was 5795 in an earlier screenshot btw, so a little higher than 5787 ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 24, 2014, 08:46:00 AM
I counted the bongs while watching the events window; I subtracted one every time someone died from something else. I wasn't trying to do anything else at the same time, and I paused often, so it wasn't so hard.

So the count certainly isn't perfect, but it's close enough.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on September 24, 2014, 08:47:36 AM
It was 5795 in an earlier screenshot btw, so a little higher than 5787 ;)

Ha! I didn't notice.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on September 24, 2014, 04:08:15 PM
well there was alot of 'suspence' :) at least , you survived it :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on October 03, 2014, 10:54:47 AM
One of the new bug fixes. Will it apply to this town as well?

* Roads will now always draw roads no matter how many there are on the terrain.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on October 03, 2014, 01:14:20 PM
I think I'll wait a bit to find out  ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on October 06, 2014, 07:40:53 PM
Got bored waiting for the 1.04 to leave beta and for everyone's stuff to stop crashing. So....

In an alternative universe, after accepting 661 nomads, Sink Mill has experienced an outbreak not of smallpox, but of diptheria. Going to see if I can struggle through the lag to reach 6000. Pop now is 5798.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on October 06, 2014, 10:07:00 PM
Interesting, the diptheria outbreak is progressing much differently than what the smallpox did. Where the smallpox exploded out into the population in a short time, the diptheria is very slow to spread. It took three months to grow beyond 10 cases. Now there are 60, and while hardly anyone has died from it, there is no hope of stopping it. I think if I could somehow go on playing Sink Mill for another 20 years, the diptheria would never go away.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on October 06, 2014, 10:21:41 PM
Wow, I am so awful. I systematically going through the town, evicting elderly couples, and watching young couples and families occupy their homes. I only need 65 more babies. ::)

121 cases of diptheria now. A few deaths.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on October 06, 2014, 11:33:30 PM
Late Autumn 75 - pop 5974

All nomads housed; took longer this time, when they weren't dropping like flies ;)

Diptheria, 426 current cases. It's going to slowly keep climbing to god knows what number. No way to stop it, certainly not with 8 hospitals, probably not with 28 or even with 48, not in this town. Not many deaths, though. A dozen maybe.

It's not letting me do a screen cap. That's disturbing.

There it is!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on October 06, 2014, 11:59:46 PM
Got up to 5980, then dropped back to 5950. So close. Tearing out some farms and building more houses, trying to generate some unsustainable growth just to reach the number.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: RedKetchup on October 07, 2014, 12:11:14 AM
hehe so many infested ^^

did they got ebola ? lol
after they will turn into zombies ?

you need a World War Z mod ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on October 07, 2014, 04:29:06 AM
 ;D After going thru the smallpox outbreak, this seems like nothing. I'm not even paying attention to them.  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: Pangaea on October 07, 2014, 06:26:36 AM
This is nothing compared to smallpox, which all things considered, MAY be the most dangerous disease in the game. This must feel like a slap on the wrist compared :D

Sooooo close, though, so I'm sure you can get there soon.

With such a big city, it would be interesting to see how cholera and plague compares in spread and deadliness compared with the original outbreak of smallpox. Would be a good testing ground :)

From slink's post about diseases:
Code: [Select]
Disease         Transmission Acquire “1 in” Percent
Name         Time Chance Radius Chance Death Death
Influenza 0.25 0.6 8 100 50 2
Mumps         0.25 0.5 8 90 35 3
Diptheria 0.25 0.55 8 80 80 1
Dysentary 0.25 0.55 8 80 25 4
Yellow Fever 0.25 0.65 8 60 20 5
Scarlet Fever 0.25 0.7 8 50 15 7
Typhus         0.25 0.75 8 40 12 8
Measles         0.25 0.75 8 30 10 10
Tuberculosis 0.25 0.8 8 20 8 13
Smallpox 0.25 0.85 8 10 5 20
Cholera         0.25 0.9 12 5 4 25
Plague         0.25 0.85 12 1 3 33
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on October 07, 2014, 05:03:09 PM
@Pangaea Well, there's a save file up from right after the nomads came, a page or two back, if you feel like fighting some lag  ;)

Late Spring 76, against my expectation, the epidemic seems to be dying out, down to 46 cases now from ~680 just a couple of months ago.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000
Post by: irrelevant on October 07, 2014, 05:19:30 PM
Early Summer 76 - pop 6000 (sigh)  :)

Now I can stop! The lag has become overwhelming.

Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Pangaea on October 07, 2014, 06:30:37 PM
Incredible dedication and planning to get to 6000. Very impressive @irrelevant :)

Would be fun to see how a disease like plague plays out on a huge city like this, but it would probably take many tries to get that disease, and it can't be fun to play when it lags badly, and then dealing with so many trading posts. Maybe I'll give it a go at some point, now when I know how to delete the achievements again ;)

Any idea when you may get another batch of nomads? Could be another record  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 07, 2014, 06:34:05 PM
@Pangaea thanks!

Yes, plague certainly would be interesting. It's a what, 1% chance?

No more nomads, this town is retired. ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: RedKetchup on October 07, 2014, 07:18:58 PM
big big congrats Irrelevant, you are THE best !

nobody will ever beat that :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 07, 2014, 07:23:33 PM
Well, I know I won't ;D

Thanks @RedKetchup that means a lot coming from you.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 09, 2014, 07:54:38 PM
@solarscreen suggested that I post some screenshots from Sink Mill, so here you go.

1) Oldtown
2) South Central Farms
3) Southwest Farms
4) West Creek Farms
5) Sheepherders' Slum
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 09, 2014, 07:56:44 PM
1) South Newport
2) North Newport
3) Boot Hill
4) North Newport Farms
5) South Newport Farms
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 09, 2014, 07:59:10 PM
1) Crossriver Town
2) Crossriver Farms
3) Eastport
4) Northeast Farms
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 09, 2014, 08:00:14 PM
1) Southport
2) Southport Farms
3) A little bit of everything
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Pangaea on October 09, 2014, 08:24:14 PM
A true Master Piece. It looks fantastic. This is the benchmark others will be striving to reach.

*tips hat*
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 09, 2014, 08:40:25 PM
Thanks, @Pangaea!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: RedKetchup on October 09, 2014, 09:25:24 PM
Magnificient !
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 13, 2014, 12:57:07 PM
@RedKetchup Merci, mon ami!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 25, 2014, 07:54:02 AM
Maybe I should fire this one back up and start replacing houses with @RedKetchup™ 2-Story Little Houses to see if I can push it to 7000, 8000, 9000.... ;D

The footprints are the wrong size, of course.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: snapster on October 25, 2014, 08:22:38 AM
Your towns tend to look wonderful for fires.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 25, 2014, 08:31:14 AM
Indeed; that's why disasters are off.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: salamander on October 25, 2014, 08:31:53 AM
@irrelevant -- I really don't understand how you do it.  Very nice.  :)

@snapster -- I don't know for sure, but I'd bet he has disasters turned off.  Many folks do that now as a matter of course because of the way townies fought fires earlier in the game.

Edit: @irrelevant's quicker with the Post button than I am ... I guess we do know, now.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: snapster on October 25, 2014, 08:38:10 AM
Why not turn them on?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 25, 2014, 08:39:04 AM
My goal for this town was to see how high I could drive the pop. I state this in the first sentence of this blog.

"Disasters on" is counterproductive to that goal.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: snapster on October 25, 2014, 08:50:23 AM
Wouldn't it be more interesting to attempt this with disasters on? More realistic.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 25, 2014, 08:52:36 AM
Trust me, it was plenty interesting with them off.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: salamander on October 25, 2014, 08:56:34 AM
I can only imagine the nightmare of trying to keep resources balanced at that scale.  :o
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on October 25, 2014, 09:00:30 AM
Food and logs were almost always pretty marginal; there was never enough to buy to build much cushion.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: canis39 on November 13, 2014, 08:12:41 AM
Wouldn't it be more interesting to attempt this with disasters on? More realistic.

This post epitomizes why Snapster won't be missed around here.  Every post had an undercurrent of "bad attitude".  Sheesh.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 15, 2015, 06:22:02 PM
In case you are wondering, this is what I'm working on these days. Thanks to @Trizeropz, the goal is pop 7100, and I will need to set a new nomad record to get there ;)

I just declined a batch of 549 nomads, they were too soon and too few; had I taken them, they would have burned through all my food and 7100 would be out of reach. I'm going to tough it out through the next five years of crawling lag and hopefully snag that 900+ batch of nomads that @Trizeropz got in his record-breaking town. ;)

So I'm going to be boring for several days at least.

I have surprised myself by finding spots to build 50 more houses. I'm systematically going through and demolishing storage, replacing with stone houses. Also upgrading wooden houses that have young Fs living in them. Trying every trick I have learned from you all these past 6 months  ;D ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on April 16, 2015, 02:53:29 AM
Good luck! I look forward to see how you are getting along with this. I'm sure you will get there.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on April 16, 2015, 08:19:08 PM
yeah good look from me too:) want to see the progress  ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 17, 2015, 06:40:04 PM
@Trizeropz here is savefile from the original 6000 town. I think that's what it is anyway. If it's something else, let me know and I'll track it down.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 17, 2015, 10:38:49 PM
Yeah, just lost 500 pop to measles. Sink Mill has some flaws, one big one being just 8 hospitals.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: RedKetchup on April 17, 2015, 10:46:18 PM
Yeah, just lost 500 pop to measles. Sink Mill has some flaws, one big one being just 8 hospitals.

ouch
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 17, 2015, 10:49:36 PM
 ;D Hey, Red. You are up to some good stuff. Your mods are beautiful.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: RedKetchup on April 17, 2015, 11:13:43 PM
;D Hey, Red. You are up to some good stuff. Your mods are beautiful.
yeah they are :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on April 18, 2015, 06:12:37 AM
wtf is wrong with this boat? @irrelevant you gave this trader some drugs:D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 18, 2015, 07:17:56 AM
 ;D There are two TPs farther up on that stream.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on April 18, 2015, 07:19:59 AM
woooooat? since when can trader swim little rivers? someone here said they only can come big rivers and lakes that are connected to big rivers:0
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 18, 2015, 07:25:22 AM
TPs on streams have always worked just like TPs on the river. The big trick is finding a spot on a stream where you actually can build one.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: rkelly17 on April 18, 2015, 07:40:49 AM
woooooat? since when can trader swim little rivers? someone here said they only can come big rivers and lakes that are connected to big rivers:0

Merchants also have the "ability" to row through narrow mud flats to get into lakes that visually do not quite connect to the river--I suspect it is a diagonal row of land squares which only touch at the corners but visually appear more solid.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on April 18, 2015, 07:54:28 AM
do you have a screenshot of that? would like to see something like that:)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 18, 2015, 08:52:29 AM
So @Trizeropz I see in your screenshot that you are demolishing cemeteries and taverns. I assume the cemeteries will be replaced with housing--and a hospital or two would be a good idea ;D ;)

What are you planning to replace the taverns with? More choppers? Cause I actually was considering doing that, same size and all. Less food to buy that way, but also less trade value to use.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on April 18, 2015, 09:12:21 AM
your village is much better than mine dude. seriously. i am just surprised about the number of your woodcutter:o built some more instead of stock piles. i changed now many things to 'late game'...
here you have a good overview:

and yeah. a hospital is urgently needed^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 18, 2015, 09:50:09 AM
Another thing I have done that you may wish to consider is adding another farmer to each field. There isn't really a need for so many laborers now, and the extra farmer is "insurance" against the game assigning farmers that live on the other side of the map.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on April 18, 2015, 09:55:11 AM
ouh i forgot that. good you said that:
btw your village got some nomads
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 18, 2015, 10:02:51 AM
That's the same time I got the batch of 549 that I turned down on reply #259 on page 18. Wish I had gotten your batch instead, I would have taken them and been close to being done!  ;D ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 18, 2015, 10:31:37 AM
your village is much better than mine dude. seriously.

Thanks! I'm quite fond of this town. :D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on April 18, 2015, 10:56:41 AM
dat balance
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on April 18, 2015, 11:13:14 AM
So close!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on April 20, 2015, 07:59:37 AM
i think you can do it. be patient and do it. you should get the 'most nomads and live' as well;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 05, 2015, 07:38:16 PM
So having learned a couple of things from my friend @Trizeropz, I have decided to go back a few years to Year 70, and work on pushing Sink Mill to pop 7000. I won't be posting much cause it is boring as hell. ;) :D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on May 06, 2015, 03:50:52 AM
It's not so boring. I want to see your progress and also know what you have changed.


Good luck. I'm sure you will make it.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 06, 2015, 05:35:46 PM
Good luck. I'm sure you will make it.
@Nilla Lol, I wish I was  ;D

Back to year 70, pop ~4300

Here's what I'm going to do differently:
1) Demolish chapels and cemeteries, replace with housing. When you demolish a cemetery, the walls get torn down right away, but the graves still decay as normally, they just are not replaced with new ones. Tearing out a cemetery takes years.
2) Replace some (many?) barns with schools and housing
3) Replace some (many?) stockpiles with choppers and housing
4) In my pop 6000 town I demolished the pastures and replaced them with wood houses starting in year 70 and finishing up ~year 75. To reach 7000 I will need to keep the pastures longer. The mutton and wool production is important. I'll have to squeeze another 200-300 houses into this town somehow before I do that.
5) I just turned a group of nomads away. The next batch is the one that I originally accepted that put me over 6000 (and brought smallpox). I'll need to turn that one away as well, and wait for the one after. That means 9-11 more years.  :P
6) As I have no mods, grow only beans and wheat. That's the next thing I have to do, go through 306 farms one by one ::)

Sink Mill is seriously handicapped by having only 31 TPs. I have found a spot where I can build one more, but that will be it.

Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 06, 2015, 07:45:19 PM
Well, here's something I've never seen. This field of squash didn't get harvested, and it didn't die back over the (apparently) very mild winter. What will happen now that it's spring?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on May 07, 2015, 02:24:08 AM
I had that once. Nothing happened. I had to demolish that field.

31 trading ports. Hmm. To my experience you can support about 120 people with one trading port, if you use it full. Your 31 (or soon 32) ports will than support 3500-4000 with trade. That means you must produce 300 000 -350 000 food each year. I can't see the size of the fields but I don't think your fields are that big.

I have one suggestion to increase the farming area; demolish some of the roads in between. They are useful at the beginning, when you only have one farmer. But I suppose you have people enough to put 3 or 4 farmers on each filed, so they have time to walk a little bit longer/ slower. The area is more important as fields.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on May 07, 2015, 06:14:57 AM
i have one suggestion too. if i would go back in time and try it again i would buy 30k tools and cloth and demolish all tailor and blacksmith instantly. its expensive at first. but if you think about the space you get out of it for crops n stuff for the next 10-15 years, its totally worth
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 07, 2015, 06:17:53 AM
@Nilla once again, we have the same idea! I was thinking about removing the roads between the fields as I was driving to work this morning. Lots of wasted space there.

The fields mostly are 120-tile. Food production currently is ~285k. With the roads gone from between fields, perhaps another 30-35k. The roads bordering the barn/house strips will have to remain.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 07, 2015, 06:33:03 AM
i have one suggestion too. if i would go back in time and try it again i would buy 30k tools and cloth and demolish all tailor and blacksmith instantly. its expensive at first. but if you think about the space you get out of it for crops n stuff for the next 10-15 years, its totally worth
That is something I may do eventually, but for now I need the coats and tools for trade to buy food and stone (in addition to the logs, iron, and wool to make more tools and coats). One coat buys 1 wool to make another coat, plus 9 food. Two tools buy one log and one iron to make two more tools, plus one stone or 8 food.

Also, the space those buildings free up will be inefficient to use for farms because of how they are sited. Most of them are adjacent to markets and not adjacent to each other, so those would make 4x8 and 5x8 farms, not very useful (can you even make farms that small?). But I could replace each one with two houses (each one has a road at each end so one of those roads can be recovered as well). That would allow me to preserve more of the pastures longer. I'd like to keep the pastures as long as I can because even though each one produces only about 600 mutton, I then use the mutton to by 3x that quantity of nuts. Doesn't sound like much but it is ~35-40k per year.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 07, 2015, 06:39:19 AM
One big problem is the food limit! If I go over 1000k the farms cease production. I am bumping up against that limit now, and have to be careful of what I buy and when I buy it. It doesn't stay over 900k for long, but interfering with the harvest even one time would be a disaster.

It's ironic that relying so heavily on farming is preventing me from stockpiling a huge food supply!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on May 07, 2015, 05:28:05 PM
 :D ;D :P

That limit of 999999 was not made in thoughts of 5000+ inhabitants. Actually it's less than 2 years food consumption.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 07, 2015, 06:03:21 PM
Indeed it was not! Course you can circumvent the limit by buying all your food instead of producing it. How many TPs would that require for 7000?? ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 09, 2015, 07:11:35 AM
Year 71 harvest is complete and many of the roads are gone. I notice that guys are now taking shortcuts across the fields in great droves. This reminds me of my first big town, which was the last one I made without roads surrounding all fields. Guys would walk across the fields regardless of crops being planted, with the result that many fields had wide cropless swaths worn into them. I need to be sure to leave some roads in high traffic areas (eg. at the ends of tunnels) so this doesn't happen in Sink Mill.

Also, since I am essentially going to be destroying all my fields and making new ones, I need to do them in small clusters. Pause, unassign workers from a few fields and destroy them, create new ones in their place, reassign workers, and unpause briefly before going on to the next cluster. What I don't want is a situation where I have to assign large numbers of farmers simultaneously; that could result in a map-wide farmer shuffle, and mass confusion come planting time.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 09, 2015, 06:20:54 PM
Halfway through the farm project. "I have a bad feeling about this."

That's why I make so many saves  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on May 10, 2015, 02:12:47 AM
So,you're the film guy? (I had to google that quote, because I somehow knew it, but couldn't put it on the right place) I'm the music girl! So if I make some quotes, it's probably some 60-70 ies song!

Do you really mean that crop is destroyed if people walk across the fields? I have never seen that. As far as I know; they don't walk on fields with growing crops, only on empty ones. This might be problem enough, if the paths are getting too long from A to B.

You need to do this farm reconstruction with much consideration and feeling. I'm sure you can do that (bad feeling or not)  ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 10, 2015, 06:02:35 PM
@Nilla, yes, I love memorizing film dialog.  ;D

I have seen mature crops with diagonal bare patches worn through them from heavy traffic. One or two guys walking through won't do it, but a steady stream will. It might need to be traders and vendors, I don't remember. I know I have one, but it would take forever to come up with the save showing that.

As I feared, despite my care the farm enlarging experiment was a disaster. Food production fell from ~285k to under 150k. Reverted to an earlier save, a whole day of very productive trading lost.

I'll remember that though, the roads between the fields really aren't necessary, unless it is a main traffic route. I'll also remember that fiddling around with farmer assignments in a large mature town is very dangerous.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on May 11, 2015, 02:01:37 AM


As I feared, despite my care the farm enlarging experiment was a disaster. Food production fell from ~285k to under 150k. Reverted to an earlier save, a whole day of very productive trading lost.

I'll remember that though, the roads between the fields really aren't necessary, unless it is a main traffic route. I'll also remember that fiddling around with farmer assignments in a large mature town is very dangerous.

That's interesting! Even with your careful approach! I never thought it would have that big impact, if you do it right; the way you did. But I think we all have noticed that it might take a year or two, until new fields are good established and proper planted/harvested. And a reconstructed field is basically a new field. And of cause a bigger settlement is more fragile than a smaller. I'm sorry it didn't work.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 15, 2015, 08:29:23 AM
Early winter 73 - pop 4936

Pop is tracking nicely, just about the same number that I had in my previous go, but in that version the pastures were mostly gone and converted to housing already. Here, they still are untouched. And there also is space in the former cemeteries for ~50-60 more houses as well. Stockpiling lots of stone, going to stick with stone houses for as long as I can in order to save firewood.

Had a school crisis a couple of years back (which I also ran into the first time, and failed to deal with adequately). I just built 5-6 more schools mainly in central locations, and that seemed to take care of it; the number of students dropped by ~15% since then, and now hardly any of the schools are full. A few pages back I discussed the effect of schools filling up, and the way this tends to cascade through the entire town, delaying the entry of educated workers and eventually resulting in uneducated 10-year-olds.

Should get the next batch of nomads arriving next year. I will turn these guys away, and prepare things to accept the following batch 4-6 years later ("FY80"). I am stockpiling as much food as I can, and my goal is to have 300-450k food in my TPs by the end of next year, by which time I expect to be well into tearing out the pastures and replacing with housing. My goal is to reach pop 6000 or more by the time the FY80 nomads arrive.

I still am not planning to do away with smiths or tailors unless there just is no other space available to build enough houses in. I need the tools for firewood production, and there just is no way for me to buy enough tools to do away for the smiths' output. In fact my stock available for trade will be declining from here on out as I will need to rely less and less on trading firewood. There simply is not going to be enough, and I've got not much space for more choppers, just here and there where I can reclaim some stockpile space.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 17, 2015, 07:27:06 PM
Starting to get the frustrating work assignments, workers commuting from the far side of the map, when there are houses with laborers right next to the producer. I've never been able to figure out what to do about this, but it is killing me now. Choppers and tailors with zero production. >:(
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: RedKetchup on May 18, 2015, 01:26:43 AM
yeah :( i dunno if it has to do with the lengh citizens they can do to make a job :S as we know, luke upgraded it in a patch long time ago :P
bah he started by reducing it, then people complained the laborers werent going to chop the trees/rocks/build when too far, and then he put it back far away.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 19, 2015, 05:46:23 AM
Maybe I have too many laborers, over 1000 of them. Going to try assigning 4 farmers/farm.

Something I just noticed, the merchants come more frequently as your pop increases. Just went over 5000, and this year they have come in Late Winter, Late Spring, and now Late Summer. While it doesn't really make it so you can buy more stuff, cause you don't have more stuff to trade away, it does make it so you don't need to buy things like stone, iron, and wool from every last boat that has them. I'm going to stop ordering those items from the general goods merchants (or from most of them anyway), with the idea that they will then bring more food.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: RedKetchup on May 19, 2015, 07:19:03 AM
yeah that was doing at the end of my old big city... i let the GG to bring what he wanted :)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on May 20, 2015, 08:09:02 AM
If I have a city that depends much on trade, I always order from the merchants; I think it's a waste of capacity, to let them bring what they want; especially the GG-merchant who carries the most. Of cause, you have to have enough stuff to sell, to be able to buy everything he brings. If not, it might be better not to order.

In Sink Mill, that maybe has too few TP for its size, I think it's most important, that you really use every merchant to the limits.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 20, 2015, 08:30:56 AM
@Nilla I'm still going to order Logs, Apples, and Pecans from the GG, just not Wool, Iron, Steel Tools, or Stone. I'll get those from the Resource Merchant.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on May 20, 2015, 08:34:56 AM
That's exactly what I meant.

One more question; How long will you build stone houses? If I remember right it takes 5-6-7 years (depending on climate) to pay off the building materials with the less firewood.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 20, 2015, 08:42:58 AM
I have about 9000 stone in stock, still buying more all the time, 200 here, 300 there. I'll continue to build stone houses for as long as I can. It will take 6-7 more years to reach the goal (now in Autumn 74), so I need to conserve firewood for some years yet. I'm not worried so much about paying off the building materials as I am concerned that I will burn through all my firewood. I'm starting to gradually phase out firewood in TPs.....not restocking it all as I spend it.

I'm being very conservative here because I have no confidence in my firewood production. It is declining year by year due to more and more choppers living far from work. As the old ones die, the "new hires" can come from anywhere it seems.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 20, 2015, 08:52:44 AM
I suppose I could start buying firewood instead of all that stone. That idea is distasteful to me though  ;D Besides, firewood is pretty expensive for something you are just going to set on fire. Plus, the mats saved by building one wooden house instead of a stone house only buys 171 sticks of firewood. Course, looking at it that way, that is about 7 years worth of the difference needed by a wooden house vs a stone one. Hmmm.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on May 20, 2015, 09:03:02 AM
Thats why i had 'to much' woodchopper;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 20, 2015, 09:05:09 AM
@Trizeropz I am building a few more, but space is an issue.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on May 20, 2015, 09:11:09 AM
yeah i used the space i got from stock piles that i reduced due to lack of logs in late game;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on May 20, 2015, 05:05:58 PM
I would stop buying stones and as the stockpiles gets more and more empty, like @Trizeropz says, build woodcutters instead.

The sinking productivity is a problem and I think itīs a good idea to let as many laborers as posssible take other proffessions. Also always look at the builders (Iīm sure you do). Builders might mix things up.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 20, 2015, 06:12:59 PM
I was wrong on the calculation of the amount of firewood that could be purchased with the difference between building wood vs stone.

Here is the correct calculation:

Logs:    24 - 16 = 8 x 2 = 16
Stone:  40 - 8 = 32 x 8 = 256
Iron:   10 - 0 = 10 x 6 = 60

16 + 256 + 60 = 332 / 4 = 83 firewood purchased with construction mat savings.

That isn't enough to justify building wood vs stone.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 20, 2015, 06:22:30 PM
I would stop buying stones and as the stockpiles gets more and more empty, like @Trizeropz says, build woodcutters instead.

The sinking productivity is a problem and I think itīs a good idea to let as many laborers as possible take other professions. Also always look at the builders (Iīm sure you do). Builders might mix things up.

I am going to continue to buy stone, but more slowly than I have been. If I get too much, I can just trade it right back.

But what I am going to do as quickly as possible, is to lay the foundations for all the houses I will build in the next five years. That will clear out the stockpiles. It also will clarify the stone situation.

The one snag here is I'm still waiting for tombstones to evaporate in the former cemeteries! >:( ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 20, 2015, 06:51:26 PM
I also have a pretty good stock of goodies squirreled away in the TPs  :D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 20, 2015, 07:53:17 PM
New housing projects
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: assobanana76 on May 21, 2015, 02:59:20 AM
I've always been curious about how others play ..  ;)

I see that many, like you, placing all the buildings and then pausing gradually building them.
I can not do so (except in rare cases where I need to understand the size) ..
I prefer to have all paused in my head and then place a building at a time ..
but do not bother you, all those great icons of pause?  ;D

however great job!
I do not think I would ever be able to handle a big map with a population so huge!  :-\
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on May 21, 2015, 06:38:04 AM
That looks very promising @irrelevant . I think i will not be much longer the big population king;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on May 21, 2015, 06:41:10 AM
I was wrong on the calculation of the amount of firewood that could be purchased with the difference between building wood vs stone.

Here is the correct calculation:

Logs:    24 - 16 = 8 x 2 = 16
Stone:  40 - 8 = 32 x 8 = 256
Iron:   10 - 0 = 10 x 6 = 60

16 + 256 + 60 = 332 / 4 = 83 firewood purchased with construction mat savings.

That isn't enough to justify building wood vs stone.

I think the calculation isn't done yet.

If I remember it right; Average annual use of firewood:
wood house about 45
stone house about 30
difference about 15

pay off time for the stone house 83/15=5,5 years

That's what I had in mind as I thought you ought to stop buying stones. But of cause; if you cannot produce enough firewood, it's not as simple as that.


But what I am going to do as quickly as possible, is to lay the foundations for all the houses I will build in the next five years. That will clear out the stockpiles. It also will clarify the stone situation.


Excellent strategy. Also because you will need fewer builders, who will mess up with the living situation and productivity.

Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 22, 2015, 04:37:39 AM
Another thing that I think is hurting my production is storing tools and coats. I've noticed that they are piling up at many smiths and tailors, lying on the ground and hanging from the clotheslines. Storing them is laborers' work, but the laborers are coming from all over the map, causing this to be delayed. I believe there probably is a limit (10?) to how many can be at the producer before the producer has to stop working and store them himself. And that is the best case; the worst case would be that he goes on working, and the additional output just vanishes. I don't know what actually happens as I have never noticed this before. Going to look more closely this evening. This probably also is happening at woodcutters. This would not affect taverns, as ale is being taken directly from the taverns to the TPs by traders.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 22, 2015, 06:10:55 PM
The producers stop working to store their stuff.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on May 23, 2015, 03:04:11 AM
The producers stop working to store their stuff.

And you have 1000s of free labourers running around? Weird! I suppose there is some problem with the calculation in such a big town. Have you examined what the laborers are doing? I suppose they are on some important mission far away from home, just to avoid the annoying work of carrying firewood from the chopper to the store.  ;)
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on May 23, 2015, 05:32:39 AM
i had this too in my town. they also dropped cloth. i never saw a cloth laying on the ground^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 23, 2015, 07:21:04 AM
Yes, everything related to logistics is starting to break down. Production of tools, coats, firewood, and ale are all down significantly from last year. I'll put some numbers up when year 75 is complete. On top of that, the harvest this year was disastrous. Everything got planted okay, but the summer was brutally hot and dry which prevented the crops from maturing; on top of that the first frost was in autumn. Can't blame that on the laborers though!  ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 23, 2015, 08:19:07 PM
Here are the production figures for the last 5 years, very discouraging (no raw material shortages, this is all due to worker commutes and logistics problems)

Firewood
71 42,236
72 40,136
73 38,364
74 38,892
75 37,212

Tools
71 6848
72 6766
73 6454
74 6268
75 5158

Coats
71 6300
72 7078
73 6042
74 5692
75 4972

Ale
71 38,210
72 34,730
73 31,540
74 30,200
75 26,260

Food
71 285,600
72 275,941
73 265,406
74 293,805 *phasing out pastures, converting sheep to food
75 132,278
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: RedKetchup on May 23, 2015, 08:41:46 PM
no shortage :) but all numbers go down :P
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 23, 2015, 08:52:53 PM
Yeah, @RedKetchup, it's really making me cranky!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: assobanana76 on May 25, 2015, 12:26:31 AM
If I remember it right; Average annual use of firewood:
wood house about 45
stone house about 30
difference about 15
and then why I have always felt that you had to calculate 70 per house ??
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 28, 2015, 07:19:55 PM
and then why I have always felt that you had to calculate 70 per house ??
Because it's good to plan for the worst case. ;)

Actually though, when you build a new house, the guys who move in will stock it immediately with ~75 firewood.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 28, 2015, 07:25:00 PM
Early Winter 76 - pop 5394

Still plugging away. Turned away nomads in summer 76, about a year later than I had hoped. That means I have to hold on somehow until FY81 or so. Going to be tough, because of last year's disastrous harvest, and the ongoing miserable ale production.

All I'm doing is building houses (and producers here and there), and trading. The screenshot shows you why I'm not posting updates; my screen is filled with construction projects. I have just a fraction of my total projects active at any given time. This is because most of them would have builders coming in from BFE and being totally unproductive. So I have a few good crews, and when they finish one project, I assign them to another project that is nearby. In order to do this, I must have all my active projects open and be watching them constantly; when one project completes I can unpause another one that is nearby, so the good builders will get reassigned to it. To make this work you must be vigilant in making sure that you have zero extra builders!

Yeah, I know, zzzzzzzzzzzzz :o :-\

I must admit, I did add a couple of mods. I added the mod that takes away the smoke, and I also added Slink's mod to do away with seed and livestock traders. My life is much improved!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: RedKetchup on May 28, 2015, 08:51:34 PM
lol thats alot of stone houses
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on May 29, 2015, 06:18:54 AM
@RedKetchup yep, I thought you'd like that. Took me years to buy all that stone!
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on June 06, 2015, 06:26:55 PM
Don't think I'm going to make it; ale production has fallen by nearly 50%, from 41,660 in 69 to 22,430 in 76. Ale is crucial to this town's success. Going to take a break, maybe come back later. Meantime, back to Frenchman's Bend.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on June 07, 2015, 02:10:05 AM
Have you figured out the exact reason for this disastrous productivity loss? Is it just "odd" behaviour caused by the size of the town or have you noticed something else?
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on June 07, 2015, 04:39:20 PM
@Nilla yes, it's because as the productive workers are dying off, they are being replaced by workers who live far from work, and these long commuters seemingly are never replaced, even though there are laborers living near the workplace. I see the same workers in the same job, year after year, who should be replaced because they live too far away.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on June 09, 2015, 05:52:19 AM
Driving to work today I had a diabolical idea for recovering this town.

I'll induce a famine by ceasing to release purchased food from the TPs. When the pop drops back to a level the game can handle, I'll resume normal production, and this time I'll concentrate on building up a food reserve. The pop should grow more quickly on the way back up the curve, so that would be fewer years needed to feed them all.

Worth a try, anyway.
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on June 09, 2015, 06:56:22 AM
You always find good ideas driving to work! I hope you don't cause some accidents by emerging too deep into your Banished thoughts. ;)

About this idea; At first it seemed excellent to me. Just a lot of work with separated couples, but that should be manageable, even in a large settlement like this. On the second thought, there might be a small problem; The limited storage possibilities. Even if you can store some food in the TP, there isn't much to accumulate; 2 years consumption. I'm not sure it's enough, if the productivity once again drops so dramatically. But I would be happy, if you prove me wrong.

If you give it a try, I would also take the productivity drop in account and try to build a large store of firewood, ale and other sellable stuff. during the "good times".
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on June 09, 2015, 07:38:20 AM
On my way to work there are some long stretches with not much other traffic.  ;D

Yes, amassing large stocks of goods for trade during the die-off and rebound would be key of this plan. The whole thing would depend on being able to amass enough stuff to buy the additional food needed when the pop starts to increase again. I've noticed that during sine waves, each subsequent increase happens more rapidly than the one before.

No longer needing to build anything should help a great deal, and not having any builders will make closing down houses to manage the separated couples much simpler.

As the pop dies off and falls back below 5000 (or whatever the "magic number" is), the resource producers should once again be replaced by workers living near where they work. The inefficiency will kick in only once they start dying of old age and are replaced by the long commuters when the pop goes back over the "magic number." This takes a number of years (5-7) to really become a problem. This plan will work only if the pop goes back up fast enough to reach the goal before the reduced production again reaches the point it is at now.

Can store 640k food in my 32 TPs. This represents more than just two years of food deficit, as the merchants come 2-4x per year, and I will be buying tons of food all the time.

Actually, I could store more than this, if I started buying additional types of food, concentrating on apples for ale production, but also a few other types. Can store 10k of each per TP.

Total TP space available is 1,920k

Too bad I can't make pies and buy books! ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on June 14, 2015, 04:52:28 PM
This plan has some difficulties that make me question its chances for success.

First, before anyone starts to starve, they will have to burn through the 370k food currently stored in houses. There is a further 330k food in storage to replace this. Also, it is spring. This 700k food will not be significantly impaired before the harvest comes in, that's another 250k.

I can suck some of this up into TPs to accelerate the process. I can have 320k each of wheat, beans, pecans, and apples, my four food resources, in TPs.

I can increase the amount of food stored in TPs by trading those foods for other foods, eg. corn, peppers, walnuts, and cherries. I could empty the TPs of tools and coats and pack in food. The stored ale--down to 18k now--must remain in the TPs. Say 30k ale, leaves room for 1890000 food, I'd need to buy another 600k food to max out the TP storage.

So, I get all this food in the TPs, and the houses start to run out, and people start to starve. At some point I need to stop that, and the only way is to release food from the TPs back into the town. But if people are starving, they don't work. There need to be enough traders with food in their homes so they keep working long enough to move food out of the TPs into storage.

The only thing I can think of to give me some control over this whole process is to fake demolish the houses of the people I will kill. That will push all of their food out into circulation where I can grab it and pull it into the TPs. When I get full TPs and empty storage, the famine will start. The only two issues are, timing (with reference to harvest) and the amount of work this is!! It is a daunting task, and I'm not sure I'm up to it. Deciding who lives and who dies, that's above my pay grade ;) Although in Banished, I guess it's really not. But I'd have to go through, house by house (1600 of them) and decide. Then I'd need to go through all the farms (that I recently assigned 4 workers to) and click them back down to 2 farmers each. ::) :o
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Nilla on June 15, 2015, 09:21:20 AM
A lot to do in such a big settlement. But if you want to make this starvation attempt; you have to fake demolish houses in any case; before or after the planned starvation. And I suppose before might be easier and cause less disturbance. "Planned starvation" - sounds mean!  :(

Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: irrelevant on August 16, 2017, 08:12:46 PM
No one ever got the joke; "Sink Mill" is how an American would pronounce the French words for "Five Thousand."

I guess that means it wasn't a very good joke. ;D
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: RedKetchup on August 16, 2017, 08:47:30 PM
No one ever got the joke; "Sink Mill" is how an American would pronounce the French words for "Five Thousand."

I guess that means it wasn't a very good joke. ;D

i guess i never tried to say the name of the town loud ^^
Title: Re: irrelevant - Sink Mill: trying for 5000, got 6000 instead
Post by: Trizeropz on August 28, 2018, 01:34:50 AM
You are waiting 2 years to tell us?^^