Author Topic: Let's talk about markets  (Read 372 times)

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Online brads3

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #15 on: July 29, 2018, 11:30:54 AM »
i don't mean to argue with you EB ,but you say easy from a modders point of view. from a players point of view though,i have seen that all markets aren't the same. the vendors have their own personalities. my guess is there are parts of the code that aren't understood and the difference in vendor personality is not intended by you modders. i do not mean for that to sound argumentative or to be critical. it is based on watching various markets and following vendors around.i am not even sure if all mods from the same modder act the same.

        there are so many markets and it is such a tedious process to follow 1 vendor constantly for a year,pause the game to check on the other workers, find the vendor again and check his inventory. it would take several months to study them. i did follow some a while back.computer ate my notes. some vendors go idle more often than others. as they are idle, some will go move items for workers while other vendors will stand still at the cemetary. the vendors all have a unique personality to them.and it does make the game interesting that way.many times the vendors will do things that doesn't make sence.seems to be hiden functions to them in the codes.it also seems that modders can affect that part of the coding without realizing it.

      again don't take any of that is being critical of any modders. the bannies having unique personalities does make the game more fun.

Online embx61

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #16 on: July 29, 2018, 12:25:46 PM »
No worries, I not think you are critical at all. Figuring out some game play stuff is interesting.
I just responded because the code of setting some flags in a market is fairly easy so not really a need for slinks code for that.

Idling is part of the happiness/health factors as well so one happy vendor with good health will behave different then a vendor with bad health and who is not happy.

I not think modders can affect the hidden code regarding professions. The professions code is fairly simple and short.
It is more references to sprites and the string table.
So a vendor from one modder will not be different then another as it is just Luke's code we use without changes.

But even added professions from different modders will not affect the hidden code if that exist because there are no "hooks" for it.
What modders have no access to they cannot change either.
If Luke programmed it so a vendor, or any other bannie, will go nuts so once in a while it will be the same for all the same professions from whatever modder.
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Online brads3

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #17 on: July 29, 2018, 03:31:14 PM »
thank you,EB. i do agree with the logic and theory.

Online embx61

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #18 on: July 29, 2018, 03:53:48 PM »
No worries @brads3
Even as a modder I keep learning each day.
So many times I had to ask Red to look over some of my code because something was not right.


The modkit has some weird stuff sometimes and I cannot always understand the logic like the Fuel added by Kid in the storage cart from Kids HO Mods I talked about in the other thread.
I was pretty sure if another mod without that fuel added was above HO it would not put fuel in the cart but it did.
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Offline elemental

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #19 on: July 29, 2018, 04:15:53 PM »
A general food market is a good solution. Stocking all types of foods and not filling up with stone or roof tiles or any of the other items that come with mods. I like to use the CC food market (or maybe it's called farmer's market) and also DS food market and EB's small food market. I don't really like building the same building over and over again on the same map (except for houses) so more food markets large and small would be welcomed by me.

Offline smurphys7

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #20 on: July 29, 2018, 05:07:10 PM »
There is no CC Food Market.  Colonial Charter has an "Edibles Market" that does NOT attempt to stock every food group.  The Edibles Market only stocks food based on what is the nearest available.  Personally, I feel that this quality makes the Edibles Market nigh useless.

Offline Goblin Girl

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #21 on: July 29, 2018, 05:41:58 PM »
How does that even work?  Does the code tell the vendor to only go so far to gather stock?  I agree that it sounds useless.  If the food is already nearby in a barn, the bannies can go there.  The real value of getting food from a market is that the populace will all have access to all four food groups.

Offline elemental

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #22 on: July 29, 2018, 05:46:05 PM »
Is there any food market that attempts to stock every food group? I think I have read that markets can only be told what food groups to stock, not how much of each different type of food. So modders can't tell a market to stock 25% of each food group. But I'm not a modder so I can't say for sure.

A general food market and a general goods market works well for me though. I used to use the CC Central market but found that it just gets filled with too much non-food items, as has already been mentioned.

Online embx61

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #23 on: July 29, 2018, 05:52:08 PM »
Yes

Modders first set the flags and then the % of how much of each can be stored.
Here is a example of the food market of the Market Set.

Code: [Select]
StorageDescription storage
{
RawMaterialFlags _storageFlags = Edible | Grain | Vegetable |Protein | Fruit;
bool _areaBasedLimit = false;
bool _available = false;
int _volumeLimit = 1800;
}

So all groups are in, even inedible as I set the four subgroups here too.
Then in another section the %.
In my case I just gave all four 25% so 25% of 1800 is 1800/4 = 450 per group if the weight is 1.

Code: [Select]
MarketDescription market
{
float _fillLimit = 0.99;

FillType _fillType
[
{
RawMaterialFlags _flags = Grain;
float _ratio = 0.250;
}
{
RawMaterialFlags _flags = Vegetable;
float _ratio = 0.250;
}
{
RawMaterialFlags _flags = Protein;
float _ratio = 0.250;
}
{
RawMaterialFlags _flags = Fruit;
float _ratio = 0.249;
}
]
}



My beloved Kathy
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Online brads3

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #24 on: July 29, 2018, 06:34:38 PM »
in you case it would stock grain 1st and fruit last. so if there was a shortage of grain, it would delay stocking of the others while it stocked up on the grain? is there anything in the market code that alters how far the vendor will travel for the items?

Online embx61

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #25 on: July 29, 2018, 06:41:24 PM »
I don't know if the order of how it is written have an impact on that a vendor have  to use the 1st first but I doubt it is the case as it makes no sense and complicate things if that was the case.
The code I written allows all food groups and i don't think the order I typed them are important but am not 100% sure.

No code opened up to us for how far a vendor will travel. It is all part of the AI code we have no access to.

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Online brads3

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #26 on: July 29, 2018, 07:31:34 PM »
on trade posts it does matter. if you trade the 1st item listed ,the 2nd and 3rd ,etc will not be stocked until the 1st is restocked.so if you are out of the 1st item, the trading post won't be very well stocked when the next merchant arrives. what others mention about the larger markets is they stock on a variety of goods plus food.not food plus other items.
     the problem SMURPHY noted months ago was early in games those other items aren't available yet and the vendor walks around looking for them.so instead of stocking food that is available,he waunders and doesn't stock enough. so say it is set to stock everything plus food and tools.it is holding space for those other items but also not stocking the food that is nearby.double edged sword not only do those odd goods tie up space,whether you have them or not. plus not having these items delays him stocking needed items.

   thankfully, modders have continued making adjustments and storage and markets are working much better.

Online embx61

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #27 on: July 29, 2018, 07:42:47 PM »
If it is coded by Luke in that way it is very bad and is not logical either.
That is why I thought he never programmed it like that also because a modder should not have to think about how to write the order.
Every game is different so a order what to stock first makes no sense.
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Offline elemental

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #28 on: July 29, 2018, 08:00:25 PM »

Modders first set the flags and then the % of how much of each can be stored.


I didn't know that was possible. Good to see that it can be done.

There is no CC Food Market.  Colonial Charter has an "Edibles Market" that does NOT attempt to stock every food group.  The Edibles Market only stocks food based on what is the nearest available.  Personally, I feel that this quality makes the Edibles Market nigh useless.

If you would like to see it coded better then send kralyerg a message. He has previously released patches and other mods based on player requests.

Offline smurphys7

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Re: Let's talk about markets
« Reply #29 on: July 30, 2018, 12:52:21 AM »
Here is a Link to the discussion on Black Liquid.  Some of my video links may be broken.

The CC Edible Market uses edibles rather than food groups because some players complained that a market could stock non-edible food like Flour.  Apparently, the CC community at Black Liquid prefers a market that could be stocking 1 Food Group (Edibles Market currently)  over a market stocking 3 Food Groups (4 food groups but 1 is inedible).