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Nilla-filling small maps

Started by Nilla, June 16, 2019, 03:48:32 PM

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irrelevant

#75
Wait! So, something just occurred to me. I have Ironman enabled in this town, does that mean that I've been playing Ironman, in addition to my other starting conditions, and didn't even realize it? ROFL!  :o ??? ;D 8)

Tom Sawyer

You can check it if you go in your running game to options -> map. If there is a line about Citizens: Ironman! then you have it already. ;D

irrelevant

#77
 :D @Tom Sawyer thanks!

@Nilla sorry for hijacking your thread!  :-[

Nilla

#78
If there´s anyone who can play "Ironman" without noticing it; it´s you @irrelevant. You´re amazing!  ;D ::) But I can still give you one small tip; search the river banks for gold nuggets. Good at the beginning to buy seeds and expensive grain.

And you can always hijack my threads. I´m honoured! :)

Not much has happened in my game; it´s slow but the settlement is still prosperous. Everything goes according to my plans. I had a theory about sick people and happiness, that I wanted to test. I had the opportunity as smallpox hit the settlement before I (deliberately) built a doctor. In other games, I have seen that if people get sick without a doctor, they are very hard/impossible to make fully happy. It has always been early in games with other bad conditions, that also have an influence of the happiness like; beeing homeless, bad diet, no coat...... But I think, I´ve seen that when later in a game, when people have a "good life", they can endure sickness without losing stars. And now, I can say for sure that´s how it is. You can see a small drop of happiness after the disease but that´s because maybe 15 people died. And children who lose a parent also lose happiness, even if there´s a graveyard. You can see that in a vanilla game as well. So again; the happiness system is complicated. It´s a combination of many things. Not possible to understand in detail.

First picture
Now I have a doctor. You can see the very nice red building in the upper right corner. There are 4 stars and 4 hearts, quite constant for a long time. (Almost?) everyone in my two villages is fully happy and healthy. The drop comes from all these people living in more remote places, like in this forest where no one has more than 3 stars and most of them less than 5 hearts, some only eat meat and have 0 hearts.

I don´t take every nomad anymore. I want to increase the rate of education, still only 32% but students are graduating, so it will improve.

Second picture

I´ve started to expand to the other side of the river. I use to start a new expansion by building pastures. They will most likely be moved to a more remote place later but it´s good to start with. The land can later easily be transformed into orchards, fields and building space.

You can see the influence of smallpox on the population graph.

irrelevant

#79
@Nilla thanks for your advice on the gold, I collected ten nuggets and the next merchant brought wheat seeds for exactly the TV of the gold. Also thanks for your very kind words! Fortunately for me, my strategy for any town involves trying to amass as much food and firewood as I can at all times, above any other consideration, which is precisely what northern ironman calls for.

Your town looks so nice!

Of course I did not stick with your advice on the small housing, to my regret. I wanted that pop boom, but what I did not count on was that the uneducated Northern bannies do not become adults at age ten. It's what, 14? ETA: Ahh, age 12. So now I am stuck with my 6 adults trying to feed 12 mouths and make goods for trade. I was trying to make fur coats, parkas, and wheelbarrows to put in the TP, but there simply aren't enough bodies to go around. So finally I bit the bullet and spent the 60 logs to build a wooden chapel. Almost instantly I was repaid with two more workers. The woman is elderly (age 33!)  ;D so they just get a goahti for now, but I'll give them a proper house eventually. Also I realized that there is no TV advantage in making fur coats or parkas compared with just selling the furs and hides (unless my thumbnail math is off), so that simplifies things.

In fact, I would say that for ironman in the north, the third priority after food and fuel would be to build that wooden chapel as soon as it could be managed. You don't have to accept nomads when they arrive, but it's nice to have the choice. There are enough tools and coats at the start to last for a few years anyway.

Two things I wonder about, does the chapel confer happiness without a cleric? I see guys idling there even without one. And will it still attract nomads? Going to find out. ETA: Nomads do come without a cleric.

What is tallow good for?

Nilla

You are right @irrelevant; the chapel is the first building I build after the first basic buildings. To your question about happiness and priest, I can say yes and no. It has an effect on the houses inside its circle and it also has an effect if you´re a member (a priest is working). Happiness is complicated. I´m not sure that you know that living in the goahti or the turf house detracts happiness. I would not say, it´s impossible to make people in these houses happy but it´s hard. All other good conditions must be fulfilled and no bad. That´s the reason that I´ve not built any turf houses, even if I do like the look very much.

From tallow, you can make lamp oil, that´s needed in the mines. You make it at the farmer´s workshop. I can´t see any in your settlement, you might have missed it because it´s at the house menu. I use it for wool coats at the beginning, you need no proper tailor, but also to grind grain. It pays off to make bread from your wheat. But of course, you must micromanage. But it´s not that bad, because you use farmers all the time. Harvest is done, close the field and make flour. No more grain to grind, bake bread. If it´s still not time to plant, go back to the workplace and make some coats. Different from all other things in Banished but it works.

I think you have seen it right; it´s none or only little profit to produce fur coats, tools and other more advanced products at the beginning with uneducated workers, better to sell the raw materials if you need to trade. I even occasionally buy tools and iron to focus on food production.

I thought my game was a bit boring; slow growth, slow expansion, a little micromanagement, a little trade: safe. But if you think like that in Banished, there´s a big chance that you´ll be punished. I was!  :-\  First picture.

Second picture
I know it from earlier games; these homeless people are terrible workers! It´s October. Normally the harvest is done but look at the fields! The orchards aren´t one bit better. In some, they have hardly picked any apples at all. I have no idea what they are doing out in the forest. If you click on one homeless out there, it might be a farmer "working".  ???  :P

But you can see; my stores contain a lot of apples, so it´s no disaster. We survived this too. It took some time to rebuild, partly because of these bad workers but also because I was out of stones and my earlier big store of logs went down, so now I´m not sure if we can produce enough firewood but we will manage. I can always close the meat and fish smokers. Not sure if they pay off, anyway.

irrelevant

#81
Quote from: Nilla on October 03, 2019, 01:39:52 AM
I´m not sure that you know that living in the goahti or the turf house detracts happiness. I would not say, it´s impossible to make people in these houses happy but it´s hard.
I did not know that. Moving towards log cabins.

It has been so hard to get this town going. Always the struggle to provide food and fuel, and then to make coats and tools when stocks run low. The nomads have been crucial to provide additional labor needed to make things run, but then you have to feed them and keep them warm.

Had lots of problems with forming new families. I build a new house when there is a couple ready to start a family, then only one of the two moves in. If I do fake demos to push things along, it just makes one of the two homeless. Finally, if I waste enough micromanagement on them, they eventually do hook up, after literally years of trying. And in the meantime, food stocks always are less than I like them to be, because my attention has been divided. Maybe they just don't really want to hook up when they are so young?

Finally got one of the merchants to bring a quantity of wild oats, and then he came again. Wild oats (and furs to buy them!) and nomads are keeping this town afloat. But maybe I'm almost to the point of breaking out of the beginning stage (in year 21!).

I absolutely cannot get wheat to make a useful crop in this climate. @Nilla is this your experience also, or just my bad luck? Looking for rye seeds....

Wheelbarrows are one of the best early trade goods out there; one log makes one wheelbarrow TV24, although production is slow. But the Farmers Workshop is perfect for this.

Nilla

#82
Quote from: irrelevant on October 05, 2019, 03:13:49 PM
Maybe they just don't really want to hook up when they are so young?
That´s exactly the way it is. You can try and try to get them together but they will not do this until they are both 15. And by then they will move together without any kind of micromanagement and leave one empty(?) house. This is one of the problems in real-time aging without schools. If the age of getting adult is lower than the age of marriage. (Maybe not with Ironman where I want the youngsters to stay at home as long as possible)  There is no way to prevent the 12 years old to move out and live alone in a house, even if you have a large number of 19 years-old of both genders.

Quote from: irrelevant on October 05, 2019, 03:13:49 PM
Finally got one of the merchants to bring a quantity of wild oats, and then he came again. Wild oats (and furs to buy them!) and nomads are keeping this town afloat. But maybe I'm almost to the point of breaking out of the beginning stage (in year 21!).
Just to let you know, wild oats (and all other food worth 1 or 2) doesn´t really belong to the North. It comes with the Tiny mod that has the NewFlora. Normally grain costs 4, fruit 5 and vegetables 3.

Quote from: irrelevant on October 05, 2019, 03:13:49 PM
I absolutely cannot get wheat to make a useful crop in this climate. @Nilla is this your experience also, or just my bad luck? Looking for rye seeds....
If you play "harsh" forget farming. If you play "fair", you can farm but you will hardly get 100% from your fields and you need to start the harvest manually in August. That´s the reason I use to play "mild" if I want to farm. It still makes sense to start the harvest manually but it´s no disaster if you forget. And don´t buy rye if you have wheat. It gives less. You may try barely but you can´t grind and bake bread from it.

I´ve been playing my town a little. Now moving towards "Modern Times". I have too much apples so I´ve decided to demolish some orchards (at least for now). It looks that I don´t need to micromanage the farmer´s workshops anymore this way. The problem is that there are too few merchants who pay daler for my apples and when they arrive they don´t bring more than a few 100 daler. Unfortunately, the same merchant with the small money bag who wants the apples also pays well for wool coats. So if this settlement grows, I will need to spam the river with TP. Not so nice. So maybe we will go back and grow some more vegetables and grain. We will see.

Edit: I just looked at your picture again @irrelevant and I see that you sell venison. If you smoke it, you can increase the value to 3. (at least by some merchants) You will need some firewood, but not very much so if you have a surplus of meat/fish that you want to sell, smoking pays off.

irrelevant

Quote from: Nilla on October 06, 2019, 01:29:09 AM
Quote from: irrelevant on October 05, 2019, 03:13:49 PM
Finally got one of the merchants to bring a quantity of wild oats, and then he came again. Wild oats (and furs to buy them!) and nomads are keeping this town afloat. But maybe I'm almost to the point of breaking out of the beginning stage (in year 21!).
Just to let you know, wild oats (and all other food worth 1 or 2) doesn´t really belong to the North. It comes with the Tiny mod that has the NewFlora. Normally grain costs 4, fruit 5 and vegetables 3.
Aw, no! :( Now I feel like I've been cheating. Not sure this town would have survived without it. I think I'll start a new town on a different map with a more forgiving climate.

And @Nilla thanks for your other helpful comments!

irrelevant


Tom Sawyer

Bread counts as grain, yes. Here is the complete food table: www.banishedventures.com/wiki/food  :)


irrelevant

#86
@Tom Sawyer Thanks so much! Started a new Ironman town, this time with a fair climate. I need a bit more practice before I can do harsh without those cheating wild oats!

Couple of families of nomads, both with ladies over 40y/o, so no long-term pop help there. OTOH, no extra unproductive mouths to feed. Non-stop micro on 2X for ten years; fun!

eta: wait! Both those families have a child now, I didn't even notice until this minute! Now I seem to remember @Nilla saying they could have children beyond 40  :)

Merchant brought cheap corn seeds; I knew that was too good to be true, should have held out for wheat  ::)

Got two goahti families that each have two children, the description in the toolbar ("a small and primitive home for a surviving family with one child") is inaccurate.

Going to move the sheep pen up to the right of the orchards, replace the existing one with farms. I'll need the space where the skinny field is for housing.

Nilla

The goahti is for families with one child. Either they had two children when they moved in or the couples have separated for a short time. Otherwise, I´ve never seen more than one child.

Good luck with your town. With a "fair" climate, you will have some struggle with wheat or rye. Good years the harvest will be OK, hardly 100% but at least worth to farm other years you will get very little. As I said; if I want to farm when I play ironman, I prefer "mild" climate. It´s less stressful. Barley works better if you want to grow grain and turnips for the start and later when your people are educated cabbage (or beans).

We are moving into our new apartment at the moment, so I have little time to play Banished at the moment. So nothing new from my town.

irrelevant

@Nilla @Tom Sawyer the two-child families definitely were just a childless couple when they first moved in. It's possible that a brief separation (would have been only for a few seconds in each case) was responsible, in each case there already was a single child. In both cases I had built a new goahti for a nomad couple, but one of the original couples (already living in a goahti with a single child) split up and instantly grabbed it upon completion. Both times I saw it happen and evicted them back to their original goahti immediately. Surprising that such a short separation would result in an additional child. Life finds a way  ;)

Question regarding trappers, does the trapping only happen in woods, or does it take place throughout the circle, even in clear areas? Time to build my trapper and I'm wondering what sort of site would be best for it.

Good luck with your move, @Nilla, moving is one of my least favorite things to do.

Tom Sawyer

Yes, trappers need forest. Especially old-growth forests where trees are not cut down as soon as matured. With intensive forestry the yield goes down. So a large untouched forest area is the best.  :)