Whats up guys, I used the search tool and didn't see anything on farming effeciency, I read on the wiki page a farmer can work a max of 56 blocks, but I have a few crops on my current town that are 9x9(81 blocks) and i have 1 farmer assigned to each field and they routinely will work the field to 100% then clear it. Am I missing something? Thanks for the help.
Early on when I set up farms, I use one farmer on 120 tile farms (11x11 or 15x8). I have to do lots of micromanagement (moving farmers between fields) during harvest to insure maximum harvest, then putting them all back for spring.
Once I get up to 15-20 farms, I start assigning two farmers to these farms. That pretty much eliminates the need for micro. I never use the default (three farmers) for this size farm, which is my standard size.
Good info, appreciate the reply. Hopefully there is a sweet spot there between 81 and 120 that 1 guy can work by himself without micromanaging them between plots.
A lot depends on the crop. Beans are no trouble at all. Corn and wheat not so bad.
Example, if I am growing half beans and half corn, the bean fields will be fully harvested in late summer. I turn off each field as it is complete, then assign the farmer to the corn field immediately next to it, so that field now has two farmers.
Also be sure the farmers don't get caught up in doing laborer tasks that prevent them from starting their planting in early spring. That can cause big problems.
QuoteAlso be sure the farmers don't get caught up in doing laborer tasks that prevent them from starting their planting in early spring. That can cause big problems.
«Today at 02:04:10 PM by irrelevant
Good tip, I've had that issue more than once. Is there a way to prevent that from happening other than not assigning large tasks right before early spring?
Assuming your beans and corn were both the same block size, does one produce more food than the other? Do some crops yield more than others?
Whenever I have big projects underway in the winter that have lots of laborers running around, I cancel/pause them all when it turns late winter. I start them back up only when I see the farmers out in their fields doing their planting.
Assuming a full harvest, I get 840 food from a 120 tile farm, regardless of whether it's beans, wheat, or corn. Most of my farming experience is with these three crops, but I believe that this is pretty much constant. Just that some of the other crops are more difficult to get full harvest from, or anyway more difficult for me.
Also look here http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=231.60 at reply #67 about halfway down the page. I forgot that I determined that wheat seemed slightly more difficult to get full yield than corn.
After reading more in that blog I realize that with a single farmer on this size field I was not regularly getting 840.
One farmer per farm. The yields do suffer somewhat. I do micromanagement come harvest, when a field is fully harvested I take the farmer and put him at whichever nearby farm has made the least progress. By the time harvest has ended I have reassigned over half the farmers, some fields have 3 or 4 farmers working. Then when it's done, I put everything back.
Where the yield really suffers is on the front end, in Spring. They don't get fully planted before summer hits. But I get more food this way than I would with those same 16 farmers on 8 fields.
edit: to clarify, I do have 32 farmers, but 16 of them are working orchards. Those farms are farmed by 16 farmers. Mostly they don't get 840, although some do. Mainly they are in the 630-800 range.
This was a post about the most yield I ever got from one farmer. My usual size of field is 81 squares, the same as yours.
Quote from: slink on May 17, 2014, 02:38:39 PM
I just finished harvesting 1008 beans from a field farmed by one person. I admit I was lucky with the season, but that was an amazing yield.
(http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28.0;attach=64)
Here is the field just before harvesting began.
(http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=28.0;attach=66)
I remember that! So fine.
If you're going to set harvest records, it's clear that it's going to be done growing beans.
Quote from: irrelevant on July 23, 2014, 01:09:25 PM
Early on when I set up farms, I use one farmer on 120 tile farms (11x11 or 15x8). I have to do lots of micromanagement (moving farmers between fields) during harvest to insure maximum harvest, then putting them all back for spring.
Once I get up to 15-20 farms, I start assigning two farmers to these farms. That pretty much eliminates the need for micro. I never use the default (three farmers) for this size farm, which is my standard size.
Quote from: irrelevant on July 23, 2014, 02:00:01 PM
A lot depends on the crop. Beans are no trouble at all. Corn and wheat not so bad.
Example, if I am growing half beans and half corn, the bean fields will be fully harvested in late summer. I turn off each field as it is complete, then assign the farmer to the corn field immediately next to it, so that field now has two farmers.
Also be sure the farmers don't get caught up in doing laborer tasks that prevent them from starting their planting in early spring. That can cause big problems.
Sorry for the old-ish thread, but it's relevant.
Most of the fields I've used so far are 12x10 or 15x8 (both 120 tiles) with one farmer tending each field. With beans it's mostly not a big problem, at least as long as the farmer doesn't fly off to the herbalist or something else silly. But often it causes big problems too, even on bean fields, and I'm losing half the crop. Have you guys found any sweet spot that one farmer can fairly reliably take care of?
I have quite liked the 15x8 size, but if something else is better then I can try to design around that instead. Right now it seems like it's too much for 1 farmer, and I've started putting 2 farmers on a few fields to see how they do (but I lack people to do that everywhere).
Here is one example. Admittedly this was a terrible year with an early winter (-7C at Late Autumn), but it's indicative of the problem in most years.
PS: I already had 2 farmers on the two big fields, and have upped this to three now.
@Pangaea, I usually do 9X9 (81 squares) or 15X6 (90 squares) with one farmer if the house and barn are right next door. If I have to go bigger than that I do 2 or 3 depending on what I see. Not sure whether this is the best use or not. The only time I have issues with harvest is when the job assignments get bumped because of lack of housing near other, nearby job sites. This is with populations under 1200.
@irrelevant and
@RedKetchup can tell you that all bets are off as the population climbs higher.
Thanks
@rkelly17. I have never built cities that big, I like watching the people walk around tending their business too much I guess, but how does big populations affect this? Doesn't the game handle jobs linked to locations well then?
Quite like the idea of only one farmer per field, so mayhaps I shall try with smaller fields and see how that goes. 15x6 would probably allow more or less the same road network and such as now. It also looks like narrow fields may be a smart thing based on how the workers operate. For example they fetch the crops from one side, when that 'row' is done, they walk back to the left side and begin anew. So narrow fields will hopefully be more efficient than same-sized more quadratical fields.
Quote from: Pangaea on September 18, 2014, 03:43:45 PM
Thanks @rkelly17. I have never built cities that big, I like watching the people walk around tending their business too much I guess, but how does big populations affect this? Doesn't the game handle jobs linked to locations well then?
You'd have to ask those who make 2000+ towns themselves (
@RedKetchup or
@irrelevant or
@Nilla ). I've never gone much beyond 1200 myself, but I think that they have said that the job selector does go a bit wonky. I know that they have to use way more traders and vendors that I ever have at lower numbers.
@Pangaea @rkelly17 what I have noticed is that as your pop reaches a certain level (~2000-2500), and you get a certain number of farms (~150-200? just guessing), the job assignment engine for farmers begins to falter a bit. When you first assign the farmers to new fields, they will not necessarily come from nearby, but might live on the far side of the map.
Normally, most job re-assignments appear to take place fairly often, a few times a year the job assignment engine shuffles things around and people end up working pretty close to where they live.
I think farmers must be done on a separate schedule, probably annually following the harvest. I'd thought I had seen it happening at the transition between late winter/early spring, but I have been watching for that, and have not seen it lately.
The good news is, even at higher pop, the farmers seem to sort themselves out after a year or two. Sink Mill has pop 3822 with 654 farmers on 315 farms, and I now have no real complaints regarding where my farmers live. But it has been 3 years now since I built a new farm.
Unfortunately , the builders never do; sort themselves out I mean, but that's a different story.
Be sure to check out the latest entry in the Sink Mill blog for more developments regarding farmer assignments, which I just noticed.
I make different size of the fields. At the beginning, when I have few people, I make quite large fields for one farmer. (7 or 8*15 is a good size).
I think this way: Some years one farmer will not be able to harvest all, some years he will. I consider the crops he gets into the barn, not the crop that freezes. On a smaller field less will freeze in a bad years, but less will be harvested on good and medium years.
Later, when I have a lot of workers, I increase the number of farmers on these fields to 2, maybe even 3 if i have many unemployed workers.
@Nilla This is exactly what I do as well, what is harvested is profit, what is lost matters not at all. Up to maybe 16-20 farms I will micromanage the harvest, turning off the farms that harvest fully and re-assigning those farmers to nearby fields that are lagging behind. Beyond that many farms, this tactic isn't so effective.
Thanks for the information
@irrelevant. I'll check out the latest update to Sink Mill.
Quote from: Nilla on September 18, 2014, 06:02:21 PM
I make different size of the fields. At the beginning, when I have few people, I make quite large fields for one farmer. (7 or 8*15 is a good size).
I think this way: Some years one farmer will not be able to harvest all, some years he will. I consider the crops he gets into the barn, not the crop that freezes. On a smaller field less will freeze in a bad years, but less will be harvested on good and medium years.
Later, when I have a lot of workers, I increase the number of farmers on these fields to 2, maybe even 3 if i have many unemployed workers.
This is what was my thinking before too, but it got quite annoying to routinely see so much of the crop die in the fields. And I figured that as cities grow big, manpower isn't really an issue, so maybe it's better to save most of the harvests each year rather than lose a good portion in cold years?
Quote from: Pangaea on September 18, 2014, 07:26:26 PM
Quote from: Nilla on September 18, 2014, 06:02:21 PM
I make different size of the fields. At the beginning, when I have few people, I make quite large fields for one farmer. (7 or 8*15 is a good size).
I think this way: Some years one farmer will not be able to harvest all, some years he will. I consider the crops he gets into the barn, not the crop that freezes. On a smaller field less will freeze in a bad years, but less will be harvested on good and medium years.
Later, when I have a lot of workers, I increase the number of farmers on these fields to 2, maybe even 3 if i have many unemployed workers.
This is what was my thinking before too, but it got quite annoying to routinely see so much of the crop die in the fields. And I figured that as cities grow big, manpower isn't really an issue, so maybe it's better to save most of the harvests each year rather than lose a good portion in cold years?
Absolutely. After you get a few dozen laborers/builders, there's really no point in skimping on farmers. At that point two on a 120-tile farm is SOP. Also pay attention to where you are putting your barns, this cannot be stressed enough. Give your farmers the shortest possible walk from their field to storage that you can; that is the single most important factor to maximizing your harvest. My farmers almost all have a barn within just a few tiles walk, and I find this really pays off. Two towns ago I was careless with my barn placement, and I can tell you it really makes a huge difference. I don't arrange my fields the way I do only because I like the way it looks.
Yes, at that point I guess it's better to have 2 farmes on 120 tiles than for example 2 farmers on these smaller 90-ish tiles.
I do make sure to have barns close by, and plenty of them. It can perhaps be improved, especially when I have more open space to play with. However, right now the main problem is that most barns are full, and it's little use to have a barn close to a field when the farmers can't empty their goods there :|
I've actually resorted to trading away food for coal just to get to grips with it. And trading away for example 5000 wheat for 5000 plums and such, to try to get some circulation going. It helps a little, but it's only a short-term solution and then it's back to 100% almost across the line. Perhaps my food has actually increased quicker than is ideal, and we just can't handle all that food right now. I've practically stopped making new fields, and hoping we can grow the population to relieve the pressure for a while.
I have found that the best way to make empty barns is to have lots of markets with lots of vendors, and lots of houses. I don't really care how close together my markets are, I'm not at all shy about overlapping circles. I find that where the circles overlap is the best place to put extra tailors, taverns, and blacksmiths. I also don't skimp on barns near the markets; I think of a barn near a market as like extra storage space within that market. A market with four barns in its circle is a market that has 34,000 storage cap instead of just 10,000.
Also, houses have storage space that is worth considering. They keep themselves stocked with up to several hundred weight each.
I hate to trade away food (except for venison and mutton for three times the quantity of nuts), later on I always wish I had it back ;) Trading one type of food for another type is smart though.
QuoteI've actually resorted to trading away food for coal just to get to grips with it. And trading away for example 5000 wheat for 5000 plums and such, to try to get some circulation going. It helps a little, but it's only a short-term solution and then it's back to 100% almost across the line. Perhaps my food has actually increased quicker than is ideal, and we just can't handle all that food right now. I've practically stopped making new fields, and hoping we can grow the population to relieve the pressure for a while.
You don´t really have to trade away the food, You can also use the trading ports as "extra emergency barn". i often do if I buy apples to make ale. Sometimes many food-trades-men come at the some time and you have too much apples in stores. If it is too much it will be carried to the barns in the farming district and block these. In these cases I often store apples in the trading ports, to use later as the store gets smaller (I sometimes do the same with stone and iron)
Quote from: irrelevant on September 18, 2014, 08:23:28 PM
I have found that the best way to make empty barns is to have lots of markets with lots of vendors, and lots of houses. I don't really care how close together my markets are, I'm not at all shy about overlapping circles. I find that where the circles overlap is the best place to put extra tailors, taverns, and blacksmiths. I also don't skimp on barns near the markets; I think of a barn near a market as like extra storage space within that market. A market with four barns in its circle is a market that has 34,000 storage cap instead of just 10,000.
Also, houses have storage space that is worth considering. They suck up several hundred weight each.
I hate to trade away food, later on I always wish I had it back ;) Trading one type of food for another type is smart though.
Good idea with the markets. I will have to put up a few more of them and see if that helps the situation. I've not built a big city before, so just getting above 3-400 is a new experience. Used to think that markets were big and I didn't want to waste unnecessary space for them, if the circles roughly touching was enough. Looks like that is wrong, and I need more of them.
Quote from: Nilla on September 19, 2014, 05:06:06 AM
You don´t really have to trade away the food, You can also use the trading ports as "extra emergency barn". i often do if I buy apples to make ale. Sometimes many food-trades-men come at the some time and you have too much apples in stores. If it is too much it will be carried to the barns in the farming district and block these. In these cases I often store apples in the trading ports, to use later as the store gets smaller (I sometimes do the same with stone and iron)
Perhaps it wasn't the best idea ever to trade away a little food, but we'll see. Since then I thankfully remembered I could store food in the trading posts too, so right now there is 40,000 food there (2 TPs). That helps a little, and getting a bit of circulation from trading e.g. 5000 wheat/beans/whatever for 5000 fruits or nuts helps too, at least for the barns closer to the TPs. What you mention there about the houses is why I put up 15 houses in quick fashion in the farming area. It does indeed look to alleviate some of the pressure.
Right now I'm storing most of the coal in the TPs as well, releasing it bit by bit in warmer days, hoping it will reduce coal snagged by citizens for heating. Really wish there was a proper priority in place here :(
@Pangaea regarding coal, I think bannies actually do prefer firewood over coal for home heating, but the firewood has to be as readily available as the coal is, and also in sufficient quantity. I've done some experiments with using purchased coal to make steel tools. In my case the coal is all swept up into markets (of course ;) ). I have had a batch of purchased coal sit in a market for an entire year while one blacksmith used it to make steel tools. At the end of that year, all of the coal had been used for tools (I know because I bought 50 coal and at the end I had made 100 steel tools), and so not a single lump had been burned for home heating. I attribute this to the fact that the market where the coal was also had several woodcutters nearby, and so firewood was always plentiful both in the market as well as in nearby stockpiles. Nobody ever had to work very hard to get firewood for home heating.
In larger coal trials, the coal found its way to most of the markets that I had built at that time. I made tons of steel tools, until that started to give me shortages of iron tools (which I was using for trade); I also found that the complex production process (3 raw materials) was too fragile and subject to disruption. I liked making steel tools, early on, up to that point. But after that I stopped buying coal and just bought steel tools instead. I'll always be open to making some steel tools, at least until I can afford to buy them. But I'll never build a coal mine, I'll always only buy coal.
Quote from: Nilla on September 19, 2014, 05:06:06 AM
You don´t really have to trade away the food, You can also use the trading ports as "extra emergency barn". i often do if I buy apples to make ale. Sometimes many food-trades-men come at the some time and you have too much apples in stores. If it is too much it will be carried to the barns in the farming district and block these. In these cases I often store apples in the trading ports, to use later as the store gets smaller (I sometimes do the same with stone and iron)
I do this, too, but not when I'm auto-trading. The silly traders sell off the stuff I want them to store for me. >:( Usually by the time I'm auto-trading I'm only selling ale and have many 3/4 empty barns spread across the settlement. My philosophy is that I can never have too many barns. I'm also with
@irrelevant on spreading markets here, there and everywhere. They keep the barns fluid and keep workers from having to go too far for supplies.
Had noticed that the blacksmiths producing steel tools wander off quite frequently to get any of the three supplies (And often come back with four logs for instance). This reduces output as they're out wandering more, and then there is the issue of citizens hording coal as well. I only have two markets. One near both blacksmiths, and there are two woodcutters there too now. The other market is basically farmland, and coal always ends up over there too. I'm now releasing it little by little, which helps, but it's a microing-nag. Have also bought some hundreds of steel tools, and you are perhaps right that it's simply better to rely more on buying tools and making iron instead. I just have this thing about not wanting to rely too much on trading as I think the mechanic is, quite simply, way overpowered.