irrelevant - Quatre Bras: incorporating mods

[irrelevant]

Speaking of production chains, I wonder whether this can introduce more or a further point to the game. Since modders control requirements of buildings (building time and/or builders required too?) and some effects (along with hopefully their appearance and even grandeur) could the point of a game be to reach the end of a chain or tree that would entail difficulty or challenge?

I'm not really sufficiently knowledgeable about modding to answer this question very well. My understanding is that there are significant limits to what is possible with modding. For example I believe that it is not possible to add new categories of resources. While it certainly is possible to make new individual resources, they must fit (or be forced to fit!) into one of the existing categories (wood, fuel, stone, iron, coal, tools, clothing, alcohol, fruit, vegetables, protein, grain....).

I also believe that it is not possible to make production of anything conditional on anything other than input resources, the construction of a production facility, and the availability of labor. And every input resource is theoretically available right from the start, although some, like coal, take a little bit of work to obtain (importing, which takes a few years to get going, or building a mine, which requires a significant investment in resources, time, and manpower). Although our modders have shown a great deal of inventiveness, and have created things previously believed to be impossible, like @RedKetchup's two story house. They may come up with some clever workarounds.

Now they could make a production chain that used another chain's product as an input, and if that chain used yet another chain's product as an input, and that chain used another.... @RedKetchup's creamery does this, makes cream, cheese, and yogurt, using milk as an input, which is an output from cattle pastures. Cream could be used as an input for some other chain, etc.

[snapster]

Saturation of resource is one thing to consider, at least so I've named it. Fundamentally things will require only so many of the types of resources which are immutable. But different resources of a type will be more saturated, meaning they will yield a lot more units of that type. Sort of like orders of magnitude. Some buildings will require players to deal with different orders of magnitude or different resources even though the type will remain the same. Different resources can be made to look differently, right? They can also be made exploitable only at certain thresholds in the game, similar to coal. Can a "resource" also be made to actually yield more than one type of resource? Something mined, gotten, or raised that is missed to yield different types of resources in proportion?

Are there different durations for constructing buildings? Input resources, prerequisite buildings, and amount (amount, right?) of labor sound adequate. Can modders determine building sizes too and actually make the buildings as they are to appear?

What can buildings be made to do?

[irrelevant]

Saturation of resource is one thing to consider, at least so I've named it. Fundamentally things will require only so many of the types of resources which are immutable. But different resources of a type will be more saturated, meaning they will yield a lot more units of that type. Sort of like orders of magnitude. Some buildings will require players to deal with different orders of magnitude or different resources even though the type will remain the same. Different resources can be made to look differently, right? They can also be made exploitable only at certain thresholds in the game, similar to coal. Can a "resource" also be made to actually yield more than one type of resource? Something mined, gotten, or raised that is missed to yield different types of resources in proportion?

I don't understand exactly what you are asking wrt "saturation". Is it possible for production of some resource to completely overwhelm demand for that resource? Absolutely. In that case it just piles up, unless you stop producing it, or trade it away, or build some other production building that uses it up. Also many products (fuel, food, tools, and coats) are consumed by houses and their inhabitants. You can always build more houses (which will lead to increased population and more consumption, and eventually, demand for even more houses).

Some production buildings produce multiple outputs simultaneously (although these are first level producers, like gatherers huts that produce 4 kinds of food, and pastures which produce mutton and wool, or beef, leather, and milk, or hunters cabins which produce venison and leather). Other production buildings have choices you make, you can produce either one thing or another, each with different inputs. You can switch back and forth at will. Each different resource can have a unique appearance.

Are there different durations for constructing buildings? Input resources, prerequisite buildings, and amount (amount, right?) of labor sound adequate. Can modders determine building sizes too and actually make the buildings as they are to appear?

Yes to everything here. There may be no limit, or more likely a very large limit, to this. You could make a structure with a huge footprint, that required hundreds of logs, stone, and iron to build, and took thousands of units of labor to construct. You also can vary the maximum number of builders that can work on a structure at the same time, so it could take literally years to build a building if you wanted to make it that way. Think "gothic cathedral"

What can buildings be made to do?

I think it basically boils down to a choice between serving as a residence, as a storage building, or as a resource producer. Well, also there are schools, and churches, and hospitals, each with specialized functions.

[snapster]

More effective resources can be introduced into the game by making them yield much more of a resource type than another resource, forcing players to deal in them and creating steps in the game. Some buildings will in turn require the much larger amounts of a resource type to be constructed. The resources could also be made to be exploitable at different stages based on the cost of the necessary buildings, etc.

Can resources be made to yield multiple types of resources was one of the questions.

You wrote that buildings can also serve as prerequisites for other buildings? Can they not serve as residences, storage buildings, or resource producers but instead as prerequisites for other buildings or even as nothing? What can buildings be made to do in relation to people?

[irrelevant]

More effective resources can be introduced into the game by making them yield much more of a resource type than another resource, forcing players to deal in them and creating steps in the game. Some buildings will in turn require the much larger amounts of a resource type to be constructed. The resources could also be made to be exploitable at different stages based on the cost of the necessary buildings, etc.

Can resources be made to yield multiple types of resources was one of the questions.

You wrote that buildings can also serve as prerequisites for other buildings? Can they not serve as residences, storage buildings, or resource producers but instead as prerequisites for other buildings or even as nothing? What can buildings be made to do in relation to people?

I don't think buildings themselves can be prerequisites for other buildings, but their outputs could be required as inputs for other buildings' outputs. I don't know whether a manufactured product can be a required material to go into the construction of a building. So far, I have not seen any buildings that required anything other than logs, stone and/or iron to build.

Certainly it is possible to mod a structure that does nothing other than take up space. I don't think you can give it any special significance though, other than to give it a happiness radius. As far as I am aware, none of the modders have talked about discovering that it is possible to make construction of a structure conditional on the presence of another structure. But there are modders at work who don't always talk about what they are up to, and in any case they don't all hang out in here.

Buildings can house people, or give them a place to work, or go to school, or to place resources into for storage.

An herbalist is an interesting case. The herbalist gathers herbs, which go into storage. Any citizen can take a herb from storage, but in order to use it, they have to take it to the herbalist shop, where it is consumed. The citizen's health then increases by 1/2 heart (10%).

[snapster]

Actually if buildings can be made to produce multiple resource types at a time then a building for a certain new resource can in turn make the yield be of different types of resources so you already gave a good response.

In a crude way even buildings can be made prerequisites for other buildings by yielding a large set amount of resources, so there's that inelegant that.

So you're saying buildings require only types of resources rather than resources? Either way.

The herbalist thing cannot be replicated by modders?

[irrelevant]

The herbalist thing cannot be replicated by modders?

I expect it could be.

[snapster]

"So you're saying buildings require only types of resources rather than resources? Either way."

What's the answer to this? I could've been wasting my time to some extent here. :p If buildings require resources rather than types things would be simpler. By the way, can modders work on the environment to introduce/accommodate new resources, kind of like oil appears in Civilization?

[irrelevant]

"So you're saying buildings require only types of resources rather than resources? Either way."

What's the answer to this? I could've been wasting my time to some extent here. :p If buildings require resources rather than types things would be simpler. By the way, can modders work on the environment to introduce/accommodate new resources, kind of like oil appears in Civilization?

Buildings require specifically a certain number of logs, stone, and/or iron. Once the required number of each resource is placed on the building footprint, the assigned builders can begin construction, which will cost a certain number of labor units.

I think "logs," "stone," and "iron," are not only specific types of resources, they also are categories of resources. But the resources required for a building are the specific types. If you created a new resource that fit into the category "stone," you would not be able to use it to build a building, as a building requires the specific resource "stone."

edit: it seems that construction material inputs are not limited to logs, stone, and iron. It may be possible to have the required construction materials be anything at all. Limited to three different ones.

See this: http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=593.0

[snapster]

Interesting indeed. Utopian domiciles are independent projects, and I think he was making fun of us. Tying it all together into a game of town progression where the demands for getting to the next stage rise and put you under pressure, with new resources, perhaps products, and buildings along the way being integral, is what modders should be aiming for to introduce more meaning into playing.

So things can't be scripted I guess is the word? For instance, you can't artificially reduce the happiness of a town for some event you're trying to create and make the recovering of that happiness conditional on something you want the player to do?

You mentioned books were involved in trading. What's the point of books in this game? What are they classified under?

[slink]

My current impression is that the Farm Market is OP, 10,000 storage for the cost of a wooden house? A barn costs way more, holds far less. At least it takes up lots of space. Still thinking about it.

The specialized markets are all built too cheaply.  They were never properly finished.  I'll get back to them one of these days, but at least I did make them a lighter shade of brown.  Until then, you can always decide what you should have paid for building them and trade away the difference at the trading post in exchange for nothing.   

[irrelevant]

@slink Yes, they do look considerably better. I like the idea of them very much, they are much handier than a regular market.

Ohh, I'm such a beancounter, I'm not sure my training will allow me to do that 

[Coug_r]

@RedKetchup - "... quatre ( = 4 = four in french) wonderbra ?"

Don't know if you got your answer but Quatre Bras means Four Arms in French.

(How do I quote ? When I click on the quote button nothing happens )

[RedKetchup]

@RedKetchup - "... quatre ( = 4 = four in french) wonderbra ?"

Don't know if you got your answer but Quatre Bras means Four Arms in French.

(How do I quote ? When I click on the quote button nothing happens )

maybe cause it was your first posts ?

if i said that it was because he made a typo error . he forgot to put an 's' he changed it thenafter.
i know  quatre bras = 4 arms, i m french !!!!!!!! LOL thats my primary home language.

and here , we called that ' brassière ' => >> 'bra' <<  (we most of the time say here, cause word too long). and a company is called like that.

... quatre ( = 4 = four in french) wonderbra ?

Ohh, I misspelled it in my post. It's correct in the game. Quatre Bras

[Coug_r]

Oh, I didn't check your profile first, didn't see you come from the Belle Province !

I still cannot quote. I tried with Chrome, Firefox and Iexplore and nothing happens when I click on the quote button :s