As the topic suggest, I wish there would be a mod adding at least a storage capacity for the production buildings so they could function as a specialized storage barn for the goods the building produces. For example, a Gatherers Hut: what does existence of this building accomplishes? Folks collect food in forests, carry it to the storage barn or market, wander on their businesses... The Gatherers hut only grants 4 people a permission to collect what is on the ground and limits the area where it happens. Seems pointless to me - why general laborers do not collect food on their own? Why do I need to construct a building that actually does nothing?
So the question is: is it possible to mod the buildings like Gatherers Hut, Hunting Cabin, Foresters Lodge and others so they can be used as specialized barns so the respective workers store the goods they collect right in there? And the townsfolk/Vendors then reference to those buildings like the Barns to grab the stuff they need?
Would also be nice if the production buildings can provide warmth so the workers would not need to go all the way back to home to warm up.
Are those things modable?
the problem is we only can target a food "flag" which mean they will store everything in that "flag" and not just what it is producing.
like example : gatherer. Gatherers are gathering fruits and vegetables.
the problem will comes from the farmers who will go store their cabages ... peppers... apple.... peaches.... in the gatherer hut.
Well, why not? ;) Let them store F&V if that building is the closest and only storage they have... I mean, considering the cost and space of those buildings they should provide some value, don't u agree? I can see how blacksmith works in it's store - stores raw materials there, then the product appears around the workshop. But it is not like that with Gatherer Hut, Hunting Cabin or Forester's lodge - those buildings are not involved in the production process anyhow!
And on top of that, the footprint of those buildings is relatively large considering they are supposed to be placed in the middle of the forest for maximum efficiency.
A simple pole with the sign can do as much as those buildings do. So IMO, the Gatherer Hut should have that F&G storage flag on. Or... Hm...
Actually, why do we even need Gatherer Hut and Hunting Cabin buildings? Is it possible to somehow make the Gatherer and Hunter professions not bound to the specific building (like Laborer or Builder) so we can assign as many of those as we want and expect the folks to grab nearest food or kill nearest deer? Is it possible?
Quote from: Yandersen on January 27, 2017, 08:18:07 AM
Actually, why do we even need Gatherer Hut and Hunting Cabin buildings? Is it possible to somehow make the Gatherer and Hunter professions not bound to the specific building (like Laborer or Builder) so we can assign as many of those as we want and expect the folks to grab nearest food or kill nearest deer? Is it possible?
Actually user Tom Sawyer has made 2 small mods that cover fishing and hunting in a way you describe. They are called Go Hunting and Fly Fishing.
I like this idea of storing food in food production buildings. Red is right of course. It cannot be realized perfectly but I would give it a try if it is possible technically. I already tried it with the herbalist but without success. It's so weird that people have to take a herb from a barn and to carry it to the herbalist. To store veges and fruits in the shelter would make sense for me too and in a forest probably no strange things would happen. A workaround would be a combined building with small gatherer shelter to define the area and a storage building as an extension.
Here the link to the hunting tool (http://banishedventures.com/hunting). Some other tools for gathering food and herbs are part of the Nordic mod. In other mods you find small objects to define the area for hunting and gathering. Kids Forest Outpost has nice things to play with including a raised hide.
Quote from: Yandersen on January 27, 2017, 08:18:07 AM
And on top of that, the footprint of those buildings is relatively large considering they are supposed to be placed in the middle of the forest for maximum efficiency.
A simple pole with the sign can do as much as those buildings do. So IMO, the Gatherer Hut should have that F&G storage flag on. Or... Hm...
If you use the forest outpost from
@kid1293, you're almost there, the "buildings " are very small, more just a spot, where they put their pots or a hunting tower for the hunter, to look out for animals. But I find your idea very good, too; to be able to store some products in these otherwise useless buildings. I hope you'll find something out
@Tom Sawyer.
Quote from: Nilla on January 28, 2017, 02:24:40 AMforest outpost
Yeah, I use those a lot, too... or the
Deep Forest items, also by Kid.
I usually set down a tiny 2x2 barn or lately also Kid's
Storage Crates, which have just enough cap to store some stuff until it can be picked up...
Sure, a truely "associated" storage would be nice - though with the small-footprint items available now I can live with it... ;)
I agree with you here, I recently made a forest addition to my maritimes mod and realized the same thing. I first made the forester, hunter etc. with a nice lodge until I realized that 1) I am over using that lodge and 2) the building itself is totally useless, even with the 2x4 foot print they were it is still a waste of space. So I decided to go down the mini forester route like the mini mod at BL and those of Kid and co. here. It makes for a much nicer lay out and you can also then add a house or storage or both without wasting a load of space. I want to do storage in the form of small caches, but there is only so much you can limit in game as others have said, 'fruit' or 'protein' etc.
Nice party we have there, thanks everyone for joining! :)
Go Hunting is definitely a good suggestion to start with, thanks, but it is far from being a good alternative to a Vanilla' Hunting Cabin. It is still an invisible building with 3x3 footprint, so space is taken anyway, plus the effect radius is ridiculously small. But the worst part of it is that it get easily lost in the woods, especially if u spam many of those.
The Kid's approach in Forest Outpost mod is much better though. Especially with Hunter Outpost - it is almost perfect actually! I thought about smg like a watchtower there (assuming it serves a purpose of tracking down the wild animals from the height, so it should be taller than trees around it):
(https://img-new.cgtrader.com/items/8457/a7be70d1ae/watchtower-3d-model-max-obj-3ds-fbx-c4d.jpg)
But the mistake Kid made is the road attachment tiles all those functionless buildings still have (they prevent trees from growing on them) - as those are not visited by the workers, they do not need to be attached to the roads. Plus the size - the tall Hunter's Outpost can be made with 2x2 footprint and still be visible in the woods, but the tiny models of Forester, Herbalist and Gatherer are lost there. Well, bigger models means bigger footprint, but as long as it smaller than the ridiculously huge vanilla versions - it is fine, IMO.
So IMO, Kid is on the right track, but he seem to stop working on Forest Outpost half a year ago...
Also, in the Forest Outpost mod I do not like the buildings' models - even if their smaller footprint is more practical, their appearance is worse than the vanilla buildings, IMO. As the cheap log-assembled wooden huts I expect them to look smg like that:
(http://44srub.ru/iz1.jpg)
And 1 more thing - the multipurpose Workshop. It is illogical that the dirty blacksmith house can be reused for textile working. It makes sense only if that would be just a Wooden Tool it can produce.
BTW, is it actually possible for a mod to completely replace model and footprint of the original building, or the only way is to spam more buttons in the UI?
A thing is always only perfect for what it was created for. :)
The hunting tool is for active and unlimited hunting. You remove it after your hunt by the quit button. To define a permanent ground by a small construction, Kids raise hide is the best solution imo. The road tiles can be removed but that's up to him.
Your picture of the log cabin looks very nice. And Russian. I made such an izba. This one here is a bit more primitive but the same base construction.
And a vanilla model can be replaced in the toolbar. I did it with the mine in the Nordic mod.
I am sorry, Tom, but I must argue on this tool being perfect it is designed for. The small effect radius suggests putting the hunting thingy directly in the place where the deer is at the moment, but since those are usually in the forest, away from the town, the footprint the "building" has must be cleaned out of trees first - so some form of the construction actually happens: laborers cut down trees and carry the log to the stockpile, only after that the hunting becomes possible. By the time it is done the deer usually leaves the tiny hunting area.
I am not suggesting an improvement of any kind - I just think that the idea itself is not good: to make a building selectable it must have a footprint, but as it has one, the placement requires cleaning of the area. I see no way how it could work without looking like a cheaty thingy. IMO, the actual model should be added as discussed in the previous post - a tall watchtower on 2x2 footprint with no road tiles to replace the vanilla's Hunters Cabin.
The Gatherers Hut and Forester Lodge is still up for a discussion. As for a Forester Lodge - is it possible to make a special kind of Stockpile able to employ Foresters? I mean, just a stockpile - the Foresters collect stone, iron and whatever they find on the defined area - all of that fits the regular stockpile, so why need anything else? In reality the forester's hut is a place the forester rests, eats, warms up, stores tools and so on:
(http://s5.pikabu.ru/post_img/big/2015/10/25/9/1445782693_1262846062.jpg)
But in game mechanics bannies do so at homes, so the stockpile itself functionally would fit better instead of vanilla's Forester Lodge, IMO. Unless that building can't be modded in a way to fit a family like a house? Maybe this will be even a better alternative for Forester, Gatherer and Hunter buildings - to serve as houses as well? Is it possible?
Quote from: Yandersen on January 29, 2017, 12:58:42 AMworst part of it is that it get easily lost in the woods
Well, here your cat bites its tail - making very small structures means that they get "lost" in denser forests, the more if the road tiles were removed... and building them high is not really an option either (your suggested hunter tower looks more like a Forest Firewatch Tower). Also, I would not call them "functionless" as they define the area (radius) of work... ;)
On the other hand, why would these small forest items need to be highly visible? Once built, they do their job and there is not much maintenance needed - else you can just open your townhall and "tab" through all hunters, gatherers, foresters etc. to check their output and occasionally relocate those that are about to be swallowed up by civilisation...
The main thing to consider imo is still storage - forest people need to drop their stuff somewhere (or store tools and clothes), to be picked up (or delivered) by laborers and vendors... so for that you need larger structures and road access again, and not too far removed from the work places (and markets or larger barns etc.)...
I'm not too "reality-driven" (like some who might say that huge storage = huge structures)... I can live very well with the notion that the forest dwellers have a large underground cache that can be accessed through a small 2x2 shack on top of a dugout... ;)
Another thing to consider is housing - 4 gatherers need 2 houses, again close enough to work places without cutting too much real estate out of forests or hunting grounds, and road access...
Forest Outpost has good small buildings for that - if any, I'd like a bit more variety (e.g. roofing) for those, the little log cabin you showed is pretty cool, too.
*
As for the multipurpose Workshop - to me that is just a (welcome) early option where I can switch between tools and clothes until I can afford to build the "real thing"... I rarely consider them permanent structures, else I build two of them later on to just do one job each... :)
I must argue about the hunting tool. I like to play Banished as a surviving game; the hardest options are my favourites. I use the hunting tool a lot early in the games. In my games it is actually quite perfect. You mustn't see it as a small version of the hunting lodge. You don't put it out in the woods, to let the hunter/s do their job. If you want to use it like that, I can understand your critics. But it's something else. That's the great thing. As Tom says, it's an
active tool. You see a flock of deer close to your settlement. It has to be close to a barn, if you want more than 1 deer, because the hunter kills an animal, carries the meat and the hide into the barn, before he/she kills the next. It's seldom a problem to find a free 2*2 spot. When the deer walk away or you have killed enough for now (you can over hunt, so it's a great part of strategy in using it) you delete it and let the former hunters do something else, until you see the next suitable flock. The small influence area isn't that fixed. Like hunters in a hunters cabin, a hunter kills every deer he/she sees, if it's inside the circle or if it's spotted somewhere else, doesn't matter.
I primary use this tool early in the games. In a big settlement it hasn't any real importance. Sometimes if I've cleared an area for farming and there's a big flock of deer in there, I might use some instant hunters, to get some cheap meat, but that's an exception.
I like a large variety of buildings, too. For me there can never be 1 perfect hunter, forester, gatherer, toolmaker, house......... It will always depend on the game, the map, if it's early or late..........
Opposite to
@Paeng, I do like "real" things; houses of a reasonable size, models based on actual historical buildings, technique that actually would work the way it looks, buildings that historically and geographically fit together... But in some games, I don't care. That's the reason, I find a mod like the Forest outpost, has its place in Banished, just the way it looks. (OK I do agree that the road parts of the small buildings without access could be taken away but these 2 tiles doesn't really matter)
I did not say the hunting tool is perfect. It is not and this placement issue is not nice. It needs these 3x3 tiles to place the marker on the ground in a suitable size. A way to let them ignore obstacles (trees) would be a great improvement but I tried a lot without success while making this tool. I just meant to not use or judge it as an alternative to a permanent hunting cabin.
And I'm also someone who wants it all realistic and reasonable. But we have the game on the other side and it always has priority imo. It makes no sense to create something perfectly realistic or pretty nice if it does not improve the gameplay. The forester is such a thing. We build clusters in the forest with a radius and it is important to easily recognize it on the map. The vanilla forester is a good solution from this point of view. Not realistic but it works very well in game. The small variants in form of mini workplaces under the trees I don't really like to use as centre of such a cluster because it is confusing.
To combine a forester, hunter or gatherer building with a residence does not work. Actually the game requires one object for one function, at least in most cases. With a storage location I'm not sure. A production building can be combined with a storage location but when it starts to produce, all not used resources will be carried out of the building. With other combinations I have no experience. The workaround is always to create two objects and to combine it in game like Reds two story buildings. The limits are placement and toolbar but it is a great concept. Just modular. And why not a two story forester's lodge with a residence upstairs. Would be realistic and working in game.
Quote from: Nilla on January 29, 2017, 04:55:41 AMOpposite to Paeng, I do like "real" things; houses of a reasonable size, models based on actual historical buildings, technique that actually would work the way it looks, buildings that historically and geographically fit together...
Oh, don't get me wrong - I like all these things as well... though I don't mind doing things a bit differently,
as long as they make sense, e.g. a rootcache driven into a mountainside to save some space or such - that makes perfect sense, imo... ;)
For hunter, gatherer and forester lodges, with their sometimes huge footprints - well
that does not really make much sense to me, at least not on all occasions.
*
Btw, that's also why I asked for a very large harbor model, not just to tweak an existing one for unrealistic high cap... :)
i agree that the forester sets could use some work,especially with expanding ideas and adding more items to gather. i have been thinking and in discussions to change some of this. however going back to the original post,i think the YANDERSEN's argument or request is that it doesn't have a storage and the bigger the building the less space to collect from.yes i think a 1x1 tree stump could be set as a forester. and then what a cellar for storage?a 1x1 pile? i don't think there is a good fix to his original point. ther best way so far seems to be to set a storage in the middle of several forest circles.i use the emporium centered in between 3 or 4 forest and hunting circles. then add a couple log cabins and a wood cutter. the emporium being a market locates tools and clothing and other food and brings it to the foresters,etc.
Brads3, we always allocate a stockpile near a Forester Lodge - that is basically all the foresters in Banished need in order to work. Therefore making a special SCALABLE stockpile able to employ Foresters and providing the working range seem to be the way to go?.. Possible?
I was messing around with CutterYard today, trying to add it some storage for the Firewood it produces. In order to achieve this I took a Tavern as an example - this is an only building storing both the input and output materials. At first glance, there was a success. The trick is simple:
1) Add "storagelocation" declaration to the CutterYard.rsc here:
ComponentDescription resource
{
// how often to update
UpdatePriority _updatePriority = Fourth;
// declare types that will be used
Description _descriptions
[
"ui",
"map",
"zone",
"toolbar",
"createplaced",
"decal",
"model",
"picking",
"highlight",
"interact",
"storage",
"work",
"statusicon",
"tracker",
"ambientemitter",
"Common.rsc:fireWoodBuilding",
"particle",
"statemachine",
"cleararea",
"workplace",
"build",
"destroy",
"storagelocation",
"consumeproduce"
]
}
2) Insert the definition of abovementioned declaration somewhere in CutterYard.rsc:
StorageLocationDescription storagelocation
{
RawMaterialFlags _storageFlags = Fuel;
}
3) Add the Fuel resource to the declared storage flags:
StorageDescription storage
{
RawMaterialFlags _storageFlags = Wood | Fuel;
bool _areaBasedLimit = false;
bool _available = false;
int _volumeLimit = 1000;
}
And voila - the Woodcutters store the produced firewood right at the CutterYard. But... Eventually an issue arises: once the volume limit (1000 by default, or 250 Firewood) is reached, then the woodcutter can not bring and store any more log: he picks 9 logs from the nearest stockpile, transfers them to the CutterYard, then walks back to the stockpile with the same 9 logs in hands (because the inventory of CutterYard is filled with firewood and does not have any more room for the input material). As the result, once the inventory is filled the production halts, even without hitting the desired production limit.
I understand, it is not a bug, technically. But this "discovery" suggests that any building storing the output product may run into such problem - I mean, Tavern is probably subjected to this bug: if Alcohol is produced faster than consumed (export-targeted setup) and cap is set high, then once the produced Ale will reach the Tavern's volume limit (300) the production at that building will halt.
Well, looking at the CutterYard building model it seems like it has a stockpile of Logs rather than Firewood. Maybe it can serve as a specialized Log storage then?..
UPD: indeed, it can actually serve as a specialized stockpile for wood! The benefit is that the Woodcutter always has a surplus of raw material at hand which saves him some running-around time (if the Forester Lodge is close so the wood is stored there). :D
will a market or even a firewood cart ner by or just outdside the circle help solve this??or wont they take the firewood? the other problem i see is if u was maxed on firewood and now the cutter filled up on logs he would become stuck. he couldn't produce firewood at all then. might not be a problem with 1 cutter but in a game where u have different cutters here n there it would. i have gotten workers in a stuck mode for different reasons and in game u do not notice it until you get real low on something.
Obviously it would. But there is no guarantee. In my case there was no market, so only the housers could take that firewood out. Plus there is a coal flagged as fuel as well, right? So it can clutter the storage the same way.
Therefore my verdict: for the CutterYard it makes sense to make it store the log only, not the final product. Maybe storing log at the Forester Lodge is achievable in a similar way, but the vanilla model suggests it to serve as housing rather than storage. Maybe building log-storage-able CutterYard close to the Forester Lodge makes sense, but I rather prefer the smaller model for the CutterYard. Like in Chop Wood mod.
Great you start modding with this issue
@Yandersen. A cutteryard with storing logs sounds not bad. A side effect is probably that the cutters get help by laborers carrying logs to this workplace. Would be an advantage to the small variants. But I also prefer the simple workplaces for chopping wood. And it should not get too much capacity. In general logs are a resource stored visible on piles.
To work as storage location for the resources which are produced at this place makes no sense as you found out. It will always block the raw materials and it has to be stored to be processed. Taverns are an exception because self destructing alcohol. Maybe better to try it with the gatherer shelter where nothing is produced and where storing would make sense. Would be interesting.
"obviously it would." hmmmm how long you been playing banished and how long you been modding?? the game has a tendancy to do weird things. as TOM said the idea if some circumstances might work better. my CC has a dock set with sheds for wood finder,storage, and a firewood stoage.
i use the firewood shed near a small chopper to keep my firewood dry. the woodfinder is good to pull logs to a sawmill. since you need housing for the forester and hunter,would a hnting lodge for storage and a modular 2nd floor for housing solve this??yes it still is a footprint in the forest but it could be set just outside the circles.
LOLz i think i ve just got an idea .... very OP lol
making it presently.......... ^^
3 models :) 1x1 tile, 1x2 tiles and 1x3 tiles ^^ (500,1000 and 2000 weight.) each firewood weight 4. so 125, 250 and 500 firewood. Ghosted.
http://worldofbanished.com/index.php?topic=1438.msg27428#msg27428
I would be more glad to see the vanilla' CutterYard remodeled, if u can, RK - remove fences, decorative small barn and 2 extra chopplaces. The ChopWood mod is good, but seem to be slightly cheaty - once the villager brings 9 logs he has to place it somewhere, otherwise the produced firewood appears to be created out of the air. I mean, the model should have some small log pile, not just a single stump on empty space. Let it be 2x3 or 2x4 including the road, let it have a storage of 500, let's say, for Wood, and look like the one in the attachment:
Quote from: Yandersen on February 01, 2017, 01:29:03 AM
I would be more glad to see the vanilla' CutterYard remodeled, if u can, RK - remove fences, decorative small barn and 2 extra chopplaces. The ChopWood mod is good, but seem to be slightly cheaty - once the villager brings 9 logs he has to place it somewhere, otherwise the produced firewood appears to be created out of the air. I mean, the model should have some small log pile, not just a single stump on empty space. Let it be 2x3 or 2x4 including the road, let it have a storage of 500, let's say, for Wood, and look like the one in the attachment:
what you ask will give just a new look, the problem will still be the same as the vanilla. a building cannot do 2 differents things in same time. yes it has a storage location cause it needs to put the log in. the firewood is not produced from thin air, it is made from logs. and you cannot store the firewood there cause he will fill it 100% with firewood and not have any place left for the logs.
this is why i offered you an alternative : a place you can store your firewood in exactly the same place where is the chopper and give you the illusion of exactly what you asked : allow the chopper to store firewood in same time :)
RED you are impressive.once again you have done the impossable.
the only way to kinda do what YANDERSEN asked,would be to take away the shed and add a specialized log pile in its place.definetly solves the overstock issues. i can see this idea being useful for many buildingspossably a small grainary to put near mills,etc. am i correct in thinking the chopped wood is decorative and won't look empty?? who has the codes for the specialized storage,those might fix that. i wish all our firewood stacked so nicely as this mod.
Well, we already came to the conclusion that produced product can not be stored in the production facility that has input product. Only the input product can be stored, and only in case if input is single. I am pretty sure the buildings like Forester lodge or Gatherer Hut can act like barns or stockpiles without a problem, but I would rather have smaller buildings. If the model is small, containing only the actual functional part, than it makes sense to allocate a barn or a stockpile right next to it. But if it is unreasonably huge like vanilla versions, than absence of model-suggested functionality makes no sense. In controversy, when a woodcutter in Chop Wood mod visits the stump with 9 logs in hands and then start chopping, then it is a bit weird to click on the stump and see logs in stock. The output firewood is on the ground, so it is fine, but the log just disappears. That is why I suggest to extend a ChopWood model with an extra couple tiles piled with log, just for a sake of some visual realism.
And the input wood storage functionality will also increase productivity if such woodcutter is placed near the Forester - in that case the Woodcutter will work almost continuously.
Quote from: Yandersen on February 01, 2017, 07:39:46 AM
And the input wood storage functionality will also increase productivity if such woodcutter is placed near the Forester - in that case the Woodcutter will work almost continuously.
try it (the little mod i made) you will see it is magic ! :)
if they are full and want to empty them... just click their trash can icons :)
Yeah-yeah, funny thing. But for those, who care about functionality only. I like realism and beauty. Placing a decoy of stack of wood which contains 0 wood is no fun for me, sorry. Stockpiles are not looking that nice, but they visualize the approximate amount and type of what stored on them. I prefer that way.
Honestly, RK, I do not like your multi-store building approach (c), which relies on players to be fair with the placement. This removes the challenge, IMO, plus it feels too faky to me. And BTW, it is possible to make a house for multiple families - like a Boarding house, but the number of people should be higher there, otherwise they will not multiply.
I am not sure if it is possible to combine Tavern and a Boarding house into an Inn, gathering production and residence into one building, but it is worth trying. If it does, adjusting dialogs to combine both UI seem to be possible. However, my experiments with GatheringHut+StoneHouse show that it may not function, but I am not 100% sure - maybe the in-building production is achievable.
BTW, I just mentioned that a placed Chop Wood stump does not show the building dialog - the regular production dialog type instead. Bug. ::)
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on January 31, 2017, 08:28:14 AM
Maybe better to try it with the gatherer shelter where nothing is produced and where storing would make sense. Would be interesting.
I tried but nothing was stored. They ran past it and filled the barn.
There are several flags to experiment with. I guess I didn't test all.
housing for multiple families is a yes and no. the banis don't like to live that way. they try to move out of them.such as a fort with a barracks,inns,boarding houses,etc. there was a 2 story house long ago,looked real nice but very problematic with functions.now RED and some others have gone to modular and made 2nd and 3rd floors,houses that stack ,since each piece is separate then they work fine. so trying to make huge apartment buildings doesn't work well. unless you tediously made it in many small pieces.
now i will throw the modders a thought,thou i doubt it possable. can houses be ghosted in a way to place 2 ghost houses over a single normal houses? say i took the fort barracks and set 3 ghost houses over it inow would have housing for 4 families??
Hold on, why multiple families don't work? I changed the number of citizen in the boarding house to 40, then started on hard and build that one only. People were multiplying in it just fine - I quit testing when the pop get over 25 or so - it was clear they make babies unlike in a BH of vanilla version (5 families and only 5 citizen - they don't multiply if over the number, as I understand). But u stating, they prefer not to go into megahouses if they have choice? Well, why? Maybe they choose by the ratio of citizen per family the house provides, choosing the one they can grow more kids? Or maybe they choose the one that has less peeps in it?..
as you found ,they will breed and live in 1 boarding house.but they prefer to live by themself.there was a nice 2 story wood log type home yrs back. the banis hated it. they would move in and out. you could destroy the home they were in ,they would move to the nicer home.sometimes you might get 2 families in it. the extra family many times would stay homeless even with the room.as soon as you have a couple and need more houses,those banis in the nice home would move out and into any other home.it must be something in the original program that the designer did not give access to. another one of those limits in the game.
you could build a barracks or even a super nice boarding house and have 5 children,and the banis will move to a tiny house instead.they'll even move way across the map on purpose to be in a house by themself. banis can be strange on some points. they waunder all over the map for no reason sometimes. just to get lost starve and freeze.they'll cross a river with no bridge and then follow it all around the map to find a way back to town.they will walk by a barn full of food and say they are hungry.i've even seen them kick banis out of town.they like to do that to teachers.
Well, just confirmed: Forester Lodge can get a storage to act as stockpile as well. It does work - foresters do put collected stuff there if the Forester Lodge is closer than stockpile. UI can be adjusted to show the inventory. Reaching the storage limit does not stop the foresters from working. Well, the vanilla model does not suggest storage, but anyway. Can't live with an idea of spending materials on building that just provides a permit for 4 people to work in the circle around it... Here is the modified code if any1 interested (stored goods set to wood, but can be anything):
I think I recently read somewhere that the first family to move into a boarding house will reproduce just fine, but all other families that move in after will not?
Hey, I just got an idea! We say, having multi-family buildings peeps prefer to go into single-family ones, right? So what if we mod all houses to be, let's say, 3 family-buildings, but limit the number of peeps to different numbers in 1- 2- or 3-store buildings? Then they all will have the same priority, right?
In theory they should.
What about procreation though? Don't they have less children when in multi family houses/boarding houses?
but it would be the most cheating mod ever made. all the houses would hold 3 famillies.
i understand that you hate everything i've been done, and i accept it :)
but when you say you hate my houses... and the little firewood store place because they are cheating....
but i see everything you want to try "in the name of realism??" you are trying to make cheating things that are 3 times more cheating than i ve done ^^
add a free wood storage to forest lodge while in vanilla it hasnt built like that ....
add a barn storage to gatherer huts while it hasnt built like that.....
make all the houses in game hold 3 times more families.....
i dunno. it is strange lol
lol RED. i sometimes wonder what yandersen is trying to accomplish also. sometimes i think he gets lost himself too. i gather he is really new to this game. the way he explains things and his bluntness that borders on rudeness, i excuse cause i think what he says is lost in the translation from 1 lanuguage to another.just like we say things that is ment to be a joke but the other person gets mad or takes it wrong. it does make for an interesting conversation. no offence intended to you at all yandersen. i figure at the rate you is going,you'll be modding in a month and we'll have a whole new game full of ideas then.
Hey, hey, hey! It was just a theoretical question, don't judge me too harsh! ;D I just tried it out to see it does not work. See, I am not unreasonable! :)
What am I trying to accomplish? I simply play Banished and mention things that could/should be done better and trying to figure out the way how it could be done. No any big idea or a certain goal - just a small things along the way. :)
I just don't understand how that housing works - what exactly makes banies avoid migrating into multi-family houses. Multi-store buildings will add a lot into game, that is why I am concerned. Well, yeah, I don't like the RK' "faky" approach to solve this, true. I think of it as a no-way-out solution. Must admit, it looks good, performs as intended, a smart trick - but it is a trick, and for some reason this makes me feel like cheating when I use it. Just like with that firewood pile mod RK recently made. Yes, if used as intended, nothing bad. But nothing stops from abusing it, right? Will be awesome if devs would spend a minute to fix those strange housing priorities the banies have, so the number of apartments set to more than 1 will not ban people from migrating into such houses.
But since normal housing behavior can be expected from 1-apartment buildings only, then the best way I see to manage multistore houses is to minimize their footprint to increase pops per area value this way. I mean, if normal house takes 5x4 tiles with road included, the multistore townhouse can be 4x4 or 4x3 - smg like this:
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-O-KX_FDSnBw/V-W9WiKeEVI/AAAAAAAARDk/8HHggeE4Sq8bafH4ocKE3anYTFmwrXwbgCLcB/s640/STONE.HOUSE.BY.PAPERMAU.003.JPG)
I know, it's ugly, but u got the idea of trade "footprintSize<->storeNumber".
"but i see everything you want to try "in the name of realism??" you are trying to make cheating things that are 3 times more cheating than i ve done ^^"
-No, I just suggested a wrong solution. I did not expected it to work cheaty as it did in my test. See, I naively thought that "int _maxOccupants = 5;" will limit the number of occupants no matter what "int _maxApartments = 1;" states, so if all buildings will be multi-appts, then the strange priorities banies show will treat all houses the same way. But it turned to be a cheaty houses instead. Me dumm, I see now. :P
"while in vanilla it hasnt built like that ...."
-Oh common, RK, what kind of arguments are those? The whole point of modding is to make things different (hopefully different = visually_better/more_realistic/more_practical/more_logical).
"add a free wood storage to forest lodge while in vanilla it hasnt built like that ...."
-And that is what I see illogical in vanilla version: to construct a building no one ever visits or uses in any way. To improve it, I think, a different model should be used. Since foresters cut trees, the FL should have a pile of logs in model - for a sake of logic; and for a sake of realism it should have a storage for log - only then the construction of that building will be justified practically. The other thing the vanilla model does not represent is a small orchard with tree plants to visually reference the source of the plantings the foresters use to grow the forest. Code-wise, my improved version of Forester Lodge with wood stockpile capabilities added to it is in the attachment.
I would be glad if someone will remodel the vanilla building and use the code to make a new mod replacing the original FL.
"add a barn storage to gatherer huts while it hasnt built like that....."
-Again, without it, what purpose does this building serves? Provides radius? Practically, it doesn't make sense to me: why can't I set that radius for Gatherers manually? What do I spend my precious wood and stone for? For a building that does not benefit banies in any way? The gatherers go home to warm up, to eat, they carry resources to the barns - so what do they build GH for? To make it serve as a beacon showing them a radius where they can grab food? Why do u need a special building to show u where to go with your own hoe and basket this morning?
Well, if it will get the food-storage functionality added, it will be practical - building the Hut provides a radius for gatherers to grab stuff and the storage at the center point of that location. Seems practical to me. But yes, slightly illogical (but not cheaty or abusive) from the game point of view, as together with desired Berries/Roots/Mushrooms/Onions that building will also absorb any veggies and fruits from the surrounding crops/orchards. It is illogical since the name of the building is GATHERER Hut. Well, it can be renamed to "Forest Barn", but it is not perfect anyway. Maybe better would be to add a gatherer's profession to the vanilla storage barns? Those are so impractically huge that hardly any1 prefer them over the variety of modded small versions, right? Idk. In my opinion, would be perfect if GH would be a place the gatherers can warm up at and store the collected stuff, but that is not what game mechanic allows... :P
"i figure at the rate you is going,you'll be modding in a month and we'll have a whole new game full of ideas then."
-Oh, I wish to be less lazy! ;D My creativity is driven by sudden inspiration only and does not last long. I see a lot of modders around there, some of them are perfect modellers as I see! I just don't understand why do they create some decorative fences instead of, let's say, huts that can be placed on river banks, or why don't they just remodel the ugly and illogical vanilla buildings to make the game look nicer? ;)
Could it be possible to somehow code a hybrid of Gatherer's hut and a Market? In such a way that it doesn't require a vendor? They both have radius but only the market stores goods.
@Gatherer. I think that makes no sense. The gatherer function creates workers who go for natural resources and the market function creates workers who go for resources from barns. What you mean can only be a gatherer shelter with a passive storage location like a barn.
@Yandersen If you have a forester lodge combined with a wood storage, you can replace the building by a stockpile as you suggested. I think it should be easy. The stored resources can be made visible by adding the storagedisplay section. But it will always use the whole area of the object. I don't want to try because not my idea of a better forester lodge.
And I have to defend the multi story concept. For me it feels not faky or cheaty. It adds a new aspect to the game in a suitable way and it's more than piling people as we can do it with smaller residences like in other housing mods. It offers a modular solution to combine different functions. A nice workaround of the "one object one function" principle. A residence upstairs a shop or workplace or another residence (interesting building sets), optional boarding housing upstairs the tavern or a second classroom in a school. Almost perfectly solvable in this way. A cheat it becomes only by ghosted floors or extensions. Because then it removes required area and cheats endless stackable game functions. That we should avoid in general and only use it for decorative items, in my opinion.
"What you mean can only be a gatherer shelter with a passive storage location like a barn."
-Actually, I found it easier to add a Gatherer Hut functionality to the storage barn. Combined UI also, see the modified code in the attachment. Feel free to include this in North mod if u like, I don't mind my ideas to be used by others - moreover, I encourage u to do so! :) As I said, I like North mode a lot and I am happy to contribute. U may just mention me somewhere if u want.
So basically, once the barn is built it allows to hire gatherers right away, no need to build GH at all. Therefore it makes it even easier to start on easy and medium difficulties as collecting food becomes possible right away since barn is prebuilt at the game's start. In other words, GH building becomes obsolete - remove or replace with smg else?..
As for a Hunting Cabin - it is always built in cluster with GH and a Barn, which are a single building now, so it makes no sense to give it a storage. It can not be a residence either. Therefore the only purpose it can serve is to define a hunting area. Considering the resent mod made by RedKetchup that adds a ghosted stockpiles, I assume it is possible to modify a GoHunting tool to be placed with no build work requirement, correct? If so, then the Hunting Cabin can be reduced to such thing - just an area definition allowing to hire hunters. However, since those are intended to be placed deep in the forests, I would prefer a 2x2 cheap wooden tower as it was discussed before - just to be able to click on it when needed.
"If you have a forester lodge combined with a wood storage, you can replace the building by a stockpile as you suggested. I think it should be easy. The stored resources can be made visible by adding the storagedisplay section. But it will always use the whole area of the object. I don't want to try because not my idea of a better forester lodge."
-Why does it matter who came up with the idea, I don't understand? I would be glad if any of my ideas will end up as some1's mod, as long as those ideas are concluded to be good. U like it? Make a mod, I will be happy to download and test it for u. :)
Will see if I can add FL' functionality to the stockpiles - will try.
how do i say this?? i have tried to explain. some things are beyond our control and were coded into the game in such a way it can not be changed. kinda like asking why the grass doesn't grow taller or why it is always daylight and never night. the developer made the game and has left the station so to speak. the banis world is the way it is and they have minds of their own sometimes. kinda like if you is playing card games and then ask why you don't roll the dice and move your piece? the game doesn't play that way.
your original idea seemed to be that the forest pieces took space away from the forest or gatherer circles. so you wanted smaller footprints. which is possable 1x1 tree stump that is a forester. but then you said you wanted that space to have a storage function. so at best now we are at 2 tiles unless the storage is ghosted under the stump. but even then to get the amount of storage to be practical the realism is gone. there is a give and take to it. on some things it is a fine line between what can work and what should work between function,looks, and realistics. the other thing to remeber with the forest is if you add storage at the center the banis have to walk all that way to get their wood or food. if you place the storage outside or at the edge of the circle then only 1 bani has to walk that way,the hunter,forester,or gatherer.
as for redesigning every building,that actually has been done to some extent.you should take a week and load more mods and try them. i gave you 2 other websites full of various mods. CC is an entirely different world. before CC came about their were tons of individual mods.
I spent some time trying to merge Stockpile functions with Forester Lodge functions - fail, both ways. At the last I tried the very minimum - to add "forester" component, workers and forester professions to the StorageYard - even with that only it crashes. Strangely, I had no problems adding storage to the ForesterLodge, but it seems like drag placement and forester are not compatible for some reason. Doesn't make any sense to me at all...
Brad, for f@$# sake, may I be so dare to ask You for a permission to evolve/change my "original idea"? Do you find unacceptable/inappropriate that I change my mind about some things as I gather new information about Banished' mechanics or develop new ideas along the way?.. >:( How ancient are u, buddy? Work on some mind flexibility, plz. :)
@brads3 and modders, perhaps this rude insolent he or she should simply be ignored in the hopes he or she will go away and not use up valuable time of our excellent modders. This person first wants a woodcutter to store firewood, insults the one made, than says prefers wood on stockpile. As you kindly pointed out, brads3, there are numerous excellent stockpiles and storage facilities in the game already, also workplaces with residences. This person obviously has no respect for others and has not read helpful informative posts already on site. Question
@Yandersen May I please ask respectfully what your age and nationality are? No other comments wanted or needed. Advice, show some respect to your elders.
@Yandersen I meant I have a different idea of a better forester lodge. Not as stockpile. More a typical lodge, good visible in the forest and with a residence upstairs but separate stockpiles around. Maybe your attempt fails because of createdrag, I don't know. But it would work with createplaced as it is and just removed model and building costs, a new footprint and added storagedisplay. Would be a stockpile with fixed area.
Thks Tom! I keep trying to implement it as u suggested, it's somewhat successfull so far - storage displayed, model "partially removed" (I am deleting the obsolete code parts one by one cathing the point where it crashes). Right now I am stuck on this one:
InteractDescription interact
{
PointList _pointList = "Models\Buildings\ForesterLodge\ForesterLodgePoints.rsc";
}Not sure what is it - an interaction locations on the model for the workers? If so, then why does it crashes once I remove this code and the "interact" line in the header? Do u know what exactly does this code mean?
It links to a pointlist resource file which links to points in the model. The points are coords for the game to define where people stay when building or using the object or where to spawn resources. When the game cannot find a necessary point it crashes. Maybe it cannot use the vanilla point list when the model is removed from this template. Then I would try to replace the model by a new empty fbx with just points (use_001, build_001).
Hm, tested out some things:
1) once storage is displayed, it draws stockpile even when building is constructed (piles of construction materials are shown). If building requires no material, it's OK.
2) Seems like "interact" component is required for any profession-defined "workplace", and since "interact" refers to the points defined by model, model must stay.
So yeah, some dummy model is required. I am no modeller, have no soft for that, so I give up there. :P
@RedKetchup I just wanted to say that your little Firewood Storage mod is wonderful. I am using it all the time now.
If people think of this mod as an option to the stockpile for storing firewood then I think they will find there is nothing "cheaty" about it. I use Colonial Charter along with various mods that give other types of stockpiles and your Firewood Storage mod is perfect as a replacement for the normal Banished big open field type of stockpile.
In fact I would like to see other stockpiles done in this more decorative style, not simply because it's more compact but because it just looks better, much more attractive than the vanilla stockpile. There are other people who dislike the look of the normal stockpile and I believe they too would like mods to make stockpiles look less like a big open field of oversized piles of wood, stone, iron, firewood etc. etc.
Quote from: TheOtherMicheal on February 13, 2017, 06:43:08 PM
@RedKetchupThere are other people who dislike the look of the normal stockpile and I believe they too would like mods to make stockpiles look less like a big open field of oversized piles of wood, stone, iron, firewood etc. etc.
Yes on both counts.
I second that.
Nice (smaller) heaps and piles are way more aesthetic.
Who needs stone close to a toolsmith?
Quote from: kid1293 on February 14, 2017, 10:22:04 AM
I second that.
Nice (smaller) heaps and piles are way more aesthetic.
Who needs stone close to a toolsmith?
^^ i guess ... i have no choice then ;D
Quote from: kid1293 on February 14, 2017, 10:22:04 AMWho needs stone close to a toolsmith?
Well, I use dedicated (specialized) stockpiles exclusively, so don't really have
that problem :)
But I agree, better looking, more random piles than all these squared off standards would be more than welcome... ;)
@TheOtherMicheal The cheat in it is to be able to store millions of firewood on 0 game tiles. If more of these storage objects I suggest to make them with the same capacity like standard piles (250/tile) and not ghosted. Just to keep storage capacity and required area in game.
i can do too but the thing about ghosted though, you can place it "inside another footprint " to get a better look overall
Ghosted is a good idea. But you could do both ghost and normal. That should keep everybody happy.
maybe ^^
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on February 14, 2017, 02:05:14 PM
@TheOtherMicheal The cheat in it is to be able to store millions of firewood on 0 game tiles. If more of these storage objects I suggest to make them with the same capacity like standard piles (250/tile) and not ghosted. Just to keep storage capacity and required area in game.
I do actually agree with you about that and if I was still playing Banished as the survival game it is originally intended to be, the ghosted firewood storage would be far too overpowered. I can also understand that for The North which preserves the survival aspects of the vanilla game, that the ghosted storage makes things a little too easy.
But with the use of Colonial Charter and other mods of that scope, Banished is not a survival game for me (and others) anymore, it's a city building/resource management game.
That's a good description. But citybuilding and resource management need required area to make sense. To create ghosted storage is the same as if we go in the resource templates and set weight = 0 for endless capacity. And what to manage then in the resource management game? Does not matter if in CC or with another mod. We already have this trend to remove requirements and limits from the game. Also required area by making things smaller and cheaper. In this way we are reducing the game more and more until there will be nothing left than a decorative scenery and the last step of reducing space is to make it ghosted (0 tiles). So if we want to keep the game alive we should keep its functions and limits. That's why I think better not to continue making ghosted storage buildings.
ok np. anyways, it was just to help the guy with its problem :S and at the end , he wasnt even liked it and he wasnt even grateful " gah your things are ugly raww raww raww" :-[
i will add the footprint to it 1x1 , 1x2, 1x3 wont be ghosted anymore :)
Quote from: RedKetchup on February 15, 2017, 01:25:31 AM
ok np. anyways, it was just to help the guy with its problem :S and at the end , he wasnt even liked it and he wasnt even grateful " gah your things are ugly raww raww raww" :-[
i will add the footprint to it 1x1 , 1x2, 1x3 wont be ghosted anymore :)
Please name it another name though, there are those of us that do love these little storage units, I like that I can put them around a building for an aesthetic reason etc. :D
Quote from: Tom Sawyer on February 15, 2017, 01:19:43 AM
That's a good description. But citybuilding and resource management need required area to make sense. To create ghosted storage is the same as if we go in the resource templates and set weight = 0 for endless capacity. And what to manage then in the resource management game? Does not matter if in CC or with another mod. We already have this trend to remove requirements and limits from the game. Also required area by making things smaller and cheaper. In this way we are reducing the game more and more until there will be nothing left than a decorative scenery and the last step of reducing space is to make it ghosted (0 tiles). So if we want to keep the game alive we should keep its functions and limits. That's why I think better not to continue making ghosted storage buildings.
Valid point, but shouldn't it be "user discretion", if an artist wants to design a piece and have it ghosted, or a player asked for a piece, shouldn't it then be up to the end user if they want to use it?
It's not being shipped with a bunch of ghosted items, the game is now run by modders (to an extent) and all of the downloads are optional
@Tom Sawyer , the same as someone wants to play hard, and The North another will want to play on Easy and add a bunch of ghosted items - a narrative for the story can be written for either.
Some days my bannis' are lost and alone and they find an abandoned shelter, other times they are world travellers, advanced party outpost builders, sometimes they live, most recently they have not. haha.
My point is, that if
@RedKetchup is happy making a ghosted storage, then cool, it won't take the edge off from players who want to play to the original vision, and play hard. :)
Sure, everyone is free to create mods and to use it or not. Also funny or cheaty things. It's cool. But why not also to talk about game functions and trends of our mods or how to improve the game and keep it alive. I think in this case of ghosted storage it is worth a thought.
I can agree with almost everything, that's said on this thread about the ghosted storage. I like the survival aspects of Banished. To me ghosted storage is "cheat", I have no plans to use them, but I also think, that they do have a purpose, if you look at the city building aspects of Banished. Normal mixed stockpiles don't look good. These ghosted storage do look nice. With them, you can put small storage of firewood on places, where they are supposed to be, without regarding if it's a "buildable" area or not. There are so many mods, that takes away the difficulties of the game. One more doesn't matter. If you don't like it, don't use it.
So
@RedKetchup, If you want to make an "unghosted" version of the nice looking storage, it's fine, but keep the small ghosted ones the way they are.
Quote from: RedKetchup on February 15, 2017, 01:25:31 AMwont be ghosted anymore :)
Correct me if I'm wrong - but is the problem not that the ghosted item offers storage (and so can be "abused")?
To me it's a beautiful model of a wood pile in the first place - primarily I want it as storage (un-ghosted), and I want it as decor (ghosted)... a
ghosted version with storage capacity is a cheat, and therefore fun - so I want it too, to use at my own discretion. Plus it's cool to know that it CAN be done - other ways to use this technique might follow ;)
On a more serious note - keeping the game "alive"... I think to ensure that, it has to stay attractive to the broadest possible range of players - from the hardcore survivalist, to the number-crunching economist, to the easy-going town builder who doesn't give a hoot about rules, to the moody player who wants a different type of town each time he starts over... to name a few :)
I do maintain that the best way to reach "everybody" is to stay as modular as possible - it's the only way for players to create their own suites of (matching) mods and and difficulty-levels, with or without "cheats", to play the game just as they envision it.
And it's the best way to add
themes - again, think Egypt, Inca, Vikings, Asian, jungle, desert, deep forests, water worlds, swamps, northpole and and and)...
hmm interesting discussions. so do we want 2 different mods? 1 for decoration and 1 for use?? personally i wish we could change the looks of the vanilla game piles and stacks,TOM did change some in his north mod. but to make a mod that changes them that works under NMT or CC might not be possable. i use some market mods to store logs and stone so i don't have hundreds of stock piles.am i cheating?? i don't check all the capacity numbers.if so it is not done to cheat it is done for looks and function.the vendor does make clearing areas faster.but in reality the game wasn't designed for each bani to use a cart to move goods. that aint my fault. we now have barns to hide piles with also. the bad point to that being you can't click on the pile to see how much is in it.and the building style may not fit everyones towns.
that last line brings us back in a circle: everyone plays different.mods are the same way. there are several mods that i don't use for various reasons. they don't suit my style. there are also many mods that i added because i wanted just part of the buildings. most of my mods are used that way. i don't build every building of every mod. may not be historically correct but stuck in the forest is anyone thinking style or would you build with whatever you find to be practical??
if there was a way to change how the piles look that would be the best solution. then players can see the piles and still click on them. if that will not work then, make new piles as ghost decorations to set over the piles. you have the new look but no storage by themself.
i agree with you PAENG,there is a time and a place to use the technique. like to add storage to an exisiting building. but i doubt it can be modded to the building so we is back to opening the door to someone to use it as a cheat.if you took the firewood and added a pile or 2 to a chopper as storage,but my understanding is a building can't serve 2 functions. do we serve the PC crowd and add warning labels to mods??lol.
but paeng plays different and cheats just to make us all look bad anyhow.but in doing so he gives us good pics and pushes us to think about our villages differently.he seems happy at it so he can't be totally playing wrong.
Quote from: brads3 on February 15, 2017, 07:29:11 AMbut paeng plays different and cheats just to make us all look bad anyhow.
I'm tempted to resent that statement... :D
Do I play differently? Yes, most probably...
Do I cheat? No, unless you consider using e.g. small forest items cheating... (else I usually note it in my journals).
Do I want others to look bad? Certainly not! I only like to share my joy for juicy images... and maybe some inspiration.
But I guess you already knew that ;)
lol,glad you didn't take that bad. i actually thought you use the debug cheat to make some of those towns. more playing as a city builder than survival.
Quote from: brads3 on February 15, 2017, 09:08:10 AMlol,glad you didn't take that bad. i actually thought you use the debug cheat to make some of those towns.
No, debug is for beta testing... or sometimes of course for quick "promotion tours" I do for new mods or releases...
*
Well, I may debug an occasional item, like I hate "growing" fences in thick forests (more an eyesight problem), or adding some bushes and props in late towns, just before the final photo session... but not to advance a town before its time, or because I lack the resources or such - my towns are natural growth...Quotemore playing as a city builder than survival
Oh yes, for sure... the survival part only interests me for the first 20 or 30 years (right, I'm not the
Adam&Eve enthusiast), so once I'm "over the hump" and pop stabilizes, I concentrate on building. So - Business before Pleasure...
The building part is definitely my main reason for playing Banished, but I also enjoy the economy, like trading, keeping ahead with food, tools, clothes, fighting occasional shortages and all... but I don't really want 200 years of struggling with 50 beans a year... from a certain point on I want my town to be handsome and comfortable ;)
so what exactly you need ?
i already made for firewood....
Training camp has one for the logs...
what else ??
Quote from: RedKetchup on February 15, 2017, 11:48:47 AMso what exactly you need ?
Oh, I'm sorry if there was a little misunderstanding... I was just reacting to some statements in this thread - there is no particular request of mine, I'm good with what you have already made :)
Quote from: RedKetchup on February 15, 2017, 11:48:47 AM
so what exactly you need ?
i already made for firewood....
Training camp has one for the logs...
what else ??
also , i need to know if i put ghosted and non ghosted in the same mod ? or do i need to make 2 seperated mods ? and what will prevent you to still download both even if you cant control yourself to cheat ? lol
@Paeng these questions are for everyone, not just at your attention ^^
My intention was not to change this firewood storage. Just to talk about the upcoming idea to make more ghosted storages for other resources and why it is a cheat. If another version of this mod then I would like to see it as decorative item as I said at the beginning. Free to place here and there at houses or at a chopper and so on would be great. But without confusing the storage system.
I'm enjoying the ghosted fireword storage piles, it's handy to be able to put one in the firewood chopper for example, I don't see them as too cheaty, but an option for unghosted with more minamal storage would be nice too. Maybe in two separate mods to give players a choice if that's desired, but It's not something that bothers me if they are both in the same mod, everyone playes their own way and giving choices is nice where it's possible.
Quote from: calli74 on February 15, 2017, 12:59:54 PM
I'm enjoying the ghosted fireword storage piles, it's handy to be able to put one in the firewood chopper for example, I don't see them as too cheaty, but an option for unghosted with more minamal storage would be nice too. Maybe in two separate mods to give players a choice if that's desired, but It's not something that bothers me if they are both in the same mod, everyone playes their own way and giving choices is nice where it's possible.
I agree with everything
@calli74 said here
bah i did both. normal with 500, 1000 and 1500 weight
and a new icon, a ghost, where are the ghosted ones. 250,500 and 750 weight.
Nice :)
Thanks
@RedKetchup for offering this and thanks for the super fast mod making! :o
Looks good. Are you doing any others like this? Stone piles? A tool rack?
Quote from: elemental on February 15, 2017, 04:33:17 PM
Looks good. Are you doing any others like this? Stone piles? A tool rack?
Training Camp has log covered and also barrel (ale & grains) presently there to double them ghosted - non ghosted.
what should look a stone pile ? exactly like in the game , or like my woodpile/firewood... something more ... accurate ?
about tools ? that i dont know. (probably stones and whatever will be in another stand alone mod. but i still need to know how to draw it)
Stone pile probably isn't necessary. Unless you can think of a clever way to make it look really good. :)
For a tool rack I was thinking something like a medieval weapons rack, only with tools. Axes, shovels, pitchforks, hoes, picks, hammers. As it is now they just throw tools on the ground in a stockpile and it looks pretty silly.
i already have some decorative weapon racks in Training Camp.... maybe i can take those ^^
but i think i ll have to split Training camp in 2 or 3 modular pieces cause it is starting to get over 50MB (ghost this.... ghost that ....)
i will maybe do :
Training Camp : Main
Training Camp : Storage
Training Camp : Decorations
i have also another big thing to add to it .... a dozen of non-animated horses :) (which will give more value to the decoration part ^^)
@RedKetchup that's excellent :D :D :D
"ok np. anyways, it was just to help the guy with its problem :S and at the end , he wasnt even liked it and he wasnt even grateful " gah your things are ugly raww raww raww"
-Excuse me, what?! Did u read my answers or Brad3' interpretations of them? Because that what turned me on - he keep misreading and misunderstanding what I say and twisted the meaning - that is what I firstly ignored, but later get angry about. Mb my english is a problem, idk - not my first language. Anyway. I never called "ur things ugly" - in contrast, RK, I think ur models are the cutest by far, and that is what I said, actually, more than once. I just said that I do not like the ghosted storage and houses just for the fakeness of this tech, pretty much for the same reason TomSawyer does, as he explained:
"That's a good description. But citybuilding and resource management need required area to make sense. To create ghosted storage is the same as if we go in the resource templates and set weight = 0 for endless capacity. And what to manage then in the resource management game? Does not matter if in CC or with another mod. We already have this trend to remove requirements and limits from the game. Also required area by making things smaller and cheaper. In this way we are reducing the game more and more until there will be nothing left than a decorative scenery and the last step of reducing space is to make it ghosted (0 tiles). So if we want to keep the game alive we should keep its functions and limits. That's why I think better not to continue making ghosted storage buildings."
And don't get me wrong - I never asked for any favors - I was just making suggestions, shared my ideas about how things should be - in my opinion, put those thoughts into an open discussion to see if other people accept or do not like those, and if they do, if there are any modders would like to lift those into their mods. That is all. I am not a modder, I just brought up some suggestions and shared my opinion about some things as a user. So u blame me for criticism? Well, OK, didn't know only positive feedback is accepted there (like in a kindergarten?), just tried to be OBJECTIVE and straight, u know. :)
As for the topic - initially, as I started that discussion, I was not aware of game mechanics and limitations, as I only had a gaming experience. Now I see the only way the initial suggestion can be implemented directly:
1) the storage for produced goods can be added ONLY to the output-only workplace buildings (that do not require any materials as input). The Gatherer Hut or Forester Lodge are the examples.
2) the workplace buildings that require input materials can NOT serve as storage for the PRODUCED goods: when capacity limit is reached, no input material can go in, thus stalling the production. That kind of workplaces can serve as storage only for the INPUT materials, not the output ones. As an example, the Cuttery Yard can act as a storage for the log, but not the firewood. Worth mentioning, that vanilla Tavern stores both input and output materials, that makes it prone to the stalling bug. However, due to a fast consumption and distribution of output material (ale) the building capacity is never actually reached.
Please use the quote function
@Yandersen. Quotes should always show the author. Otherwise we cannot see the right context. If you answered this quote of me, it might be a misunderstanding. It was about the idea of storage buildings in form of ghosted items like the firewood pile from another thread and how it can kill the game if we follow this trend. Not about your suggestion to include some storage in proper buildings. That is not ghosted storage because limited in area. For the gatherer shelter and a few more I have it on my list.
@RedKetchup how about some of those horses without the saddles?
Quote from: Abandoned on February 16, 2017, 07:27:13 AM
@RedKetchup how about some of those horses without the saddles?
there will be 12 horses without the saddles (beneath the saddles, the horses mesh are different than the horses without saddles)
and there will be 6 horses with saddles.